Concerning Hobbits

[Black Breathalizer]

There has been some interesting side discussions in the "Jackson got it right on the Scouring" thread about Jackson's treatment of the hobbits as one of the primary themes of the books.

What do you think? Has Peter Jackson been true to Tolkien concerning Hobbits?

We can talk about this both in terms of their general portrayal in the films as well as the underlying "power of the common man" themes of the books vs. the movies.

[Lizra]

I'm not getting Frodo yet. Hopefully, Jackson will do more with him in RoTK than he has. In the movie, he comes off (to me) as a privileged young hobbit who gets stuck with a nasty job, that he's afraid to do. In the book, I get more of the intellectual "elf friend", who has more sense of the world around him (not just the Shire) than the other hobbits, and a deeper well of "spirit" to draw from. The other three hobbits project well enough, but I get too much "fear" from Frodo in the movie. The changed Ford scene and the elimination of the Barrow Down sequence are probably the cause of this. Still, I will hold judgement till I see everything.

[Firekitten2006]

Yeah I dont like how PJ seemed to make Frodo a very very big baby. In the books he's slightly older than the other hobbits, and seems to accept what he has to do, and doesnt whine about it. PJ seemed to stay pretty true to Merry and Sam, but I dont think you can get from the movie that Pippin is the youngest of the four, and is pretty much a child. So apart from Pippin and Frodo I'm happy. :)

[Fat middle]

none of the hobbits is developed enough so far. i agree with what have been said about Frodo, and i'd add that i don't like E. Wood's performance. i'm dissapointed.

Sam is getting better. he had very few lines in FOTR, but i'm begining to like him in TTT.

Pippin's also getting better, but he isn't funny enough. same as Sam, i like his look.

Merry. perhaps his character is okay, but i just cannot stand D. Monaghan's face :o

[Elvedans]

Originally posted by Firekitten2006
Yeah I dont like how PJ seemed to make Frodo a very very big baby. In the books he's slightly older than the other hobbits, and seems to accept what he has to do, and doesnt whine about it. PJ seemed to stay pretty true to Merry and Sam, but I dont think you can get from the movie that Pippin is the youngest of the four, and is pretty much a child. So apart from Pippin and Frodo I'm happy. :)

I think that actually tolkien makes Frodo seem more like a baby as he becomes so dependent on Sam, but i think it is a good thing. I think the aging could have been shown better.

[Indril Anarion]

I like the way Hobbits were portrayed in the movie, but I agree that Frodo seems a bit wussy. In the book, I imagined him as a bit stronger and braver, yet a bit afraid, but willing to take the challenge. In TTT, a bit of a tougher Frodo comes out. So I guess it's a good development. I believe Sam, Merry, and Pippin's characters played out as in the books...

[Elvedans]

Sam and Pip were the best portrayed. Actually, no, Bilbo was brilliant too.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Didn't like Frodo. Sam was brilliant. Bilbo was excellent. Pippin downright sucked, In My Opinion. Neutral on Merry. Sackville-Bagginses were good. ;)

[Lady Tinuveil]

For all being aprx. 30 yrs. of age, none looked it... I think Frodo wines too much in the film and pj left a lot of the story line out.
His interepitation is not too bad, I cant wait for two towers to come out on video, Ill be first in line...

[Gwaimir Windgem]

How old would Merry and Pippin have been at the party?

[Lady Tinuveil]

Are ther any sites avaliable(?) that show how to stich hobbits clothes? Or Rangers clothes? I am a master with my sewing machine, I wish I could find hobbit patterns. Can Anyone help?

[Elvengirl]

Sam was great! Pippin and Merry were good. Frodo was ok, he's too wimpy, and I personally don't think he looks like a hobbit. I think Elijah could pass for an elf.
The Shire and all other hobbits looked perfect. I love the hobbit children.

How old are they supposed to be? I think I remember Frodo being close to fifty when he leaves Bag End. I'll have to check on that.

[Celebriel]

I think Bilbo was portrayed pretty closely to the books, but I hated the whole "Ahhh, ring! Let me bug my eyes!".

Frodo does look like a wuss. I thought PJ started his deterioration too quickly.

I do like how Sam is shown as strong (pulling Gollum off Frodo) and overprotective (not trusting Gollum).

---

As far as I know, Frodo was 33 when Bilbo turned 111.

[cassiopeia]

According to the book Pippin would be 11 and Merry was 19 at the time of Bilbo's party. Of course this doesn't translate to the movie because the hobbits left the Shire very soon after the party, not after 17 years as in the book.
I agree with Lizra about Frodo. The only thing I like it that he looks good. :D
Sam is brilliant (Po-tay-toes!). Bilbo is excellent. Pippin is all right. Don't care about Merry (though how did he gained 50 IQ points in TTT is beyond me). Gollum is brilliant. :)

[samwise of the shire]

PJ seemed to stay pretty true to Merry and Sam, but I dont think you can get from the movie that Pippin is the youngest of the four, and is pretty much a child. Uhhh fire kitten...Pippin IS a child in the book...the time before 33 is the irresponsible tweens...which means he's still a teen when they go on the quest...28 to be precise...or in human terms that would be 14.
Frodo is a wimp in the movie I must profess. They were just trying to show the audience the innocence of the hobbits...and Frodo is about as innocent lookin' as you can get. It's REALLY sad to see him reduced to a bunch of quivering nerves.
I thought that Merry was a bit more immature in LOTR:FOTR than he was in the book...but he kind of smarts up in TTT...or else other charecters were dumbed down *coughs and glances at a statue of Treebeard*. Sam starts growin' up as well...honestly Sean Astin should get an Oscar for best supporting...or else Andy Serkis should. Those two did VERY good.
Frodo turned into a pessimistic wet blanket.
Cheers,
Sam

[Lady of Rohan]

I also agree with what is being said about Frodo. I thought that Sam was great. Merry and Pippin "matured" alot from FotR to TTT. I am fine with Merry and Pippin though, only Frodo bugged me.

[Dunadan]

Seems like there's almost consensus on Frodo being crap and Sam being great. I wonder how much of this is the casting, how much is the script/direction and how much is the acting.

Frodo was certainly cast too young to be faithful to the book; also the actor seems capable of only one facial expression. However, I think the main problem is that his character was rewritten in one dimension. None of his decisive or insightful actions were carried over.

BB, did you mean hobbits in general rather than the individual characters? If that's so, I think it was like the rest of the films: design, costume and effects were brilliant but the direction and editing was heavy-handed at times, making the characters cartoon-ish and disrupting the flow of the story.

cheers

d.

[Fat middle]

Originally posted by Dunadan
BB, did you mean hobbits in general rather than the individual characters? If that's so, I think it was like the rest of the films: design, costume and effects were brilliant but the direction and editing was heavy-handed at times, making the characters cartoon-ish and disrupting the flow of the story.


i cannot agree more.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Not quite true, he did decide to go to Mordor by himself.

[durin's bane]

In my opinion, Sam was wonderful and Bilbo was good, too, except for the whole big, buggy eyes when he held the Ring. Pippin and Merry were all right, but I think they went from silly dopes to Mr. Serious too quickly. Frodo...cute, but that's the only good side. The portrayal was awful, and he fell on his butt too much. In the books, Frodo was strong, mature, and brave, calm most of the time, and confident. It wasn't until he reached Mordor and the Ring became almost impossible to bear did he let himself go a little.

[Elvengirl]

I'm curious to how well frodo will do in ROTK. :)

[Lizra]

Regarding Frodo's "one" facial expression...remember when BoP said he looked "constipated"! Too funny! ;)

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Yeah, they just stuffed him full of burritos then threw him on the scene. ;)

[BeardofPants]

Originally posted by Lizra
Regarding Frodo's "one" facial expression...remember when BoP said he looked "constipated"! Too funny! ;)

And I'm still amazed that I lived to tell the tale. ;)

[Lizra]

They (Elija fangirls) sure were "irritated"! :D I always start laughing when the troll skewers him, that look is REALLY constipated! ;)

[Elvengirl]

lol, yea, he does, I hadn't thought of of that. hahaha

[Shadowfax]

Originally posted by Lady Tinuveil
Are ther any sites avaliable(?) that show how to stich hobbits clothes? Or Rangers clothes? I am a master with my sewing machine, I wish I could find hobbit patterns. Can Anyone help? This is an excellent site, they are researching just about every costume form the movie! (look in the "characters" section): http://www.alleycatscratch.com/lotr/



**Sorry that was off topic**

[azalea]

I seem to be one of the few that liked Elijah's Frodo. I did think he looked too young, and all of the hobbits were kind of "pretty." I think they could have been a little rougher around the edges (not ugly or course, but not so polished -- perfectly straight teeth, nice skin, silky hair, etc.) Merry's nose for instance, was a good hobbit nose -- a little unusual. I do think PJ's hobbits were definately his own interpretation of them, not necessarily just like the book, but that is to be expected, for good or ill.

[cassiopeia]

Elijah has crooked teeth. :p :D

[crickhollow]

Originally posted by cassiopeia
Elijah has crooked teeth. :p :D well can you imagine a hobbit with braces? :p

[Elvengirl]

I think it's funny how Sam and Frodo's accent seemed to change. In some scenes Sam would sound American with a few English pronunciations thrown in. And it really bugged me how Elijah said the word "before" hehe :D

[Elvedans]

I found that when Sam said "What are you doing?" he sounded american. A few characters had dodgy accent moments but it is only natural.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

But you'd think as many times as they reshot, they could have redone the dubbing till they got the accents right.

[support_your_local_elf]

Agreed about the accents. In the FotR, Frodo had some sort of English accent, but in TTT, it really wasn't so strong. Another thing that really bugs me is how Sam says "been" in the FotR. It sounds like bean or something like that. Every time I watch it I get really annoyed. :mad:

[Elvedans]

Been and Bean sound the same anyway don't they. How can you tell the difference? Do you think it should have sounded like "bin"?

[crickhollow]

Americans say "ben" for 'been'

[englishnerd]

Re: Bean/Ben

you're right, "been" with the british accent to me at least sounds more like "Bean."

Yeah, I noticed TTT sounding more american with Sam and Frodo.

You know, I liked frodo sometimes, but the screenwriting doesn't give him much room for more than one expression. He spends, like 20 minutes in FOTR gasping and choking, just in time to recover for the cave troll. I guess it's a result of speeding up the time between the crisis points so they run right into each other for the sake of the movie time. Frodo is right at the center of many crises', so all we see of him is the gasping choking "constipated expression."
*side note* nothing to Yoda's when he raises the ship in Star Wars. *heehee*

[cassiopeia]

I would have thought saying 'been' as 'bean' is correct, since they seem to be trying to use an English accent in the LOTR. I always imagined the characters having a type of English accent, considering Tolkien was English.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

I agree with cass. Anyhow, they invented the language, so the way they say it out to be right. :p

[Dúnedain]

Originally posted by azalea
I seem to be one of the few that liked Elijah's Frodo.

I am with you azalea, I really like Frodo so far. He is pretty much the way I read him in the book as well. I thought Frodo in the book was whiny too! Also, I think in the movies you do see the separation of Frodo from the other three, I mean he solves the riddle outside of Moria, he recites portions of Elvish in the movie, he is clearly the most educated of them all. I also think that you see his gearing down from the ring as well, don't forget this has to be down in a total of 9 hours, so naturally his decline will be a little quicker. Overall though I think Frodo is great, I like him. Yes some parts he appears to be a bit of a wimp, but other parts he is a tough hobbit.

Sam = One of the best in the movie, hobbit or not, awesome!

Merry = I really liked Merry more in TTT, as you got to see more of his fighting side and wanting to get down and dirty (stop it you sicko's!)

Pip = I like Pip too, I think in Fellowship you get to see his more juvenile side and then in TTT I think you see him "coming of age" a bit. Although some might not agree, the whole Ent thing when Pip gets Treebeard to go to Isengard, because he knows it will get the Ents involved, I liked. At first I didn't, because I wanted it done at the Entmoot like in the book, however it makes great sense the way it was done in the movie, because it shows the true strengths of Pip coming out and growing up...

Bilbo = rules!

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Actually, it doesn't make sense. :p

[Elvengirl]

Originally posted by Dúnedain

Pip = I like Pip too, I think in Fellowship you get to see his more juvenile side and then in TTT I think you see him "coming of age" a bit. Although some might not agree, the whole Ent thing when Pip gets Treebeard to go to Isengard, because he knows it will get the Ents involved, I liked. At first I didn't, because I wanted it done at the Entmoot like in the book, however it makes great sense the way it was done in the movie, because it shows the true strengths of Pip coming out and growing up...



I didn't like how Pippin had to show Trebeard what was happening at Isengaurd. Why wouldn't he know what is happening in his own forest?

But I do like Pippin and how he does grow up.