Elvish when spoken....

[Dúnedain]

I've been meaning to comment on this for a while now, but I kept forgetting so here goes :D

After watching the extended version of FotR, the scenes that were added back in during Lothlorien, I really noticed something about the Elvish language when it is spoken. It sounds so close to the spoken form of Latin. Has anyone else noticed that? If not, go back to the part where Galadriel and Aragorn are talking to each other in Elvish just before they leave Lothlorien, I really noticed it there, the way Galadriel speaks the similarities really come out there, in my humble opinion :D

Besides, with Tolkien being a linguist expert, I am sure he based it off of the Latin derivatives anyway....

[Falagar]

Quenya was based on Latin, Finnish and Italian (I think)

Sindarin was based on (at least the sound) Celtic and Welsh.

[Bronwyn of Gondor]

It sounds a little like Latin (I'm not exactly well-versed, but I've heard it spoken before. :))... I don't know, at the time I was more or less trying to read the subtitles so I didn't feel like a complete idiot not knowing was was going on, but I guess I need to listen again.

[Wayfarer]

Yes, it sounds like latin. Which is annoying because I'm gtongue tied and can't roll my R's.

[WallRocker]

The Elvish language being Derived from Latin would make since. I believ it even talks about this in a way in the Silm. Something about Elvish becoming like Latin, onlly used in ceromonies and such*AAAGH - I'm posting about the books in the Movie forum**WallRocker slaps himself:)***

[Gwaimir Windgem]

In the Letters of JRR Tolkien (Which is NOT a Lord of the Rings book!) Tolkien says that Quenya is like an "Elf-latin"; but I think he only means in the respect that it is used in ways similar to Latin.

[Thrain]

I take Latin at school and it is slightly like the language but not much. For one LAtin is a much harder and choppier speech where as elvish just kind of flows out of the mouth.

[Dúnedain]

Originally posted by Thrain
I take Latin at school and it is slightly like the language but not much. For one LAtin is a much harder and choppier speech where as elvish just kind of flows out of the mouth.

Of course Latin is harder and choppier when you are learning it, however for those who are able to speak it fluently and hear it spoken from those who are fluent in it, the language is very graceful...

[Huan]

No, the elvish tongues aren't really intended to be based on Latin, and spoken Elvish (Sindarin) doesn't really sound like it. The tounges' strongest influence was Finnish. Gwaimir took the words from my mouth: Quenya is LIKE Latin in the sense that no one goes around speaking it; it's "book-Elvish." Or like Quran Arabic versus the zillions of modern Arabic dialects, though every Arab still learns Arabic as written in the Quran 1000-odd years ago. That's Quenya. Or like ancient Greek, which I can read, but I couldn't speak at all with a modern Greek, because the language sounds so different now.

[Evenstar1400]

i bet JRRT didnt mean for it to sound like latin, but when it comes to making languages you can be influenced by the words and sounds from another language.

[Huan]

Oh yeah, all the languages Tolkien knew went into his creation of Elvish. He kind of did this fictional back-formation to invent the tongue that might have influenced the first human Indo-European speakers, so he invented words that could have conceivably evolved into their modern equivalents in real-world languages. Taking my own handle as an example, huan, the Elvish word for dog, combines all the variations of the Indo-European family Tolkien was most familar with. In it you have his theoretical basis from German and Old English "hund," (modern English "hound"), Latin "canus," and Greek "kuon." It is especially a synthesis of "hund" and "kuon." These did all develop from the same root, and Tolkien used his knowledge of sound changes to trace it back to what it might have sounded like when the elves first influenced us: they were the first with a spoken language after all.

[Yapaluna]

Huan´s analysis seems to me quite right.

Watching the FotR-video very often I remember only two words that Arwen uses when she makes the river wash away the ringwraiths. They are "Bruinen" and "Hithaeglir". She pronounces them the way I would have done it if I had to read them loud (in the book).

Her language seems to me being Sindarin and not Quenya. Am I right? All these "th" in it is not usual in Quenya.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Yes, all of the Elvish spoken is Sindarin, I believe, as Quenya is really a form of "book-Elvish."

Sad to say, but I have memorised her River-calling spell. :(

[Dúnedain]

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
Sad to say, but I have memorised her River-calling spell. :(

Sad indeed! :D

[Elf Girl]

Originally posted by Falagar
Quenya was based on Latin, Finnish and Italian (I think)
No, you've got it backwards. Latin and Finnish were based on Quenya, and Italian was based on latin.

[Huan]

Thank you, Yapaluna.