olympic torch orc *SPOLIERS*

[elendili]

this may seem like a dumb question but why did the orc with the olympic torch who stuck out like a sore thumb not umm die when legolas shot him twice?? it wasn't as though he was unhurt but he just carried on to blow up the wall. Any good explanations?

I love this you watch a film, praise it and then start to rip it to shreds :D

[Sminty_Smeagol]

Ummm the same reason Boromir was fighting off orcs after 3 arrows had hit him? And the same reason Aragorn fell off a cliff and came back the next day?

btw I love your avatar!!!

[Gwaimir Windgem]

I liked the esheep better. Love those little wool-balls!

[Cirdan]

PCP?

[Wayfarer]

Or Crystal Meth, maybe.

[Elf Girl]

None of the arrows hit his heart, or other area that would kill him instantly.

[Andúril]

Oooh me me!

"Fly, you fools!"

Any guesses?

[Elfhelm]

Deus Ex Machina?

[Andúril]

I've never heard of the "Deus Ex Machina" drug.

[unregistered]

Fell as he was dying? One final leap?

[samwise of the shire]

*Puts on Hermione expression and prepares to play the part of walking encyclopedia* Deus-Ex-machina is a Greecian expression meaning God of the Machiene. The original Deus-Ex-machina was a crane like machine used in greecian dramas to lift actors paying gods from the cat walks on the buildings holding the scenery down to the stage so their characters could intervine with whatever the other characters were up to. In literature a Deus Ex Machina is an unexpected twist in the plot of a play or story that saves the heroes butts, it's usually instigated by a relative that the author forgot to mention. Deus-Ex-Machinas usually weaken plots terribly and turn them REALLY stupid so there aren't alot of those in literature.
I dont think that the Orc was a Dues-Ex-Machina. I think that PJ had that planned...DEM's are usually unexpected by both reader/audience and author/playwright.
this may seem like a dumb question but why did the orc with the olympic torch who stuck out like a sore thumb not umm die when legolas shot him twice?? OLYMPIAN torch? ISENGARDIAN would be more like it. Elendilli how many times have I told you to keep OUR own mountains HERE on OUR earth and NOT in Middle Earth? ;) J/K
I think the orc was on his last legs...that's why he lept into the colvert...because he would've failed in his mission as official Isengardian torchbearer and the torch would've gone out...so technically he was dying from Legolas's arrows.
Cheers,
Sam
ps. Isengardic Games...I like it! When do they start? What're the medals? A gold ring, a silver brooch and a brass pot...Sounds good. ;)

[Wayfarer]

Deus Ex may weaken the plot in a novel, but it was one killer game. I reccomend it.

[Evenstar1400]

ummmm.......... i kinda thought it was funny that the isengardian was running with a torch....... immediately thought of the olympics.......... but then i thought (within the duration he was running) that the torch was going to be used for some evil purpose that had something to do with the spiked balls that were placed beneath the walls. yeah. anyway. why he didnt die. i agree with sminty_smeagol. yeah. okay. thats it.

[Millane]

he was a Berzerka nothing could have stopped him...
that scene was pretty cool but how much better would it have been if it had a scene before it with him getting hyped up and pouring some flammable liquid all over himself and setting himself alight and charging...
way better

[Black Breathalizer]

Originally posted by Sminty_Smeagol
Ummm the same reason Boromir was fighting off orcs after 3 arrows had hit him?Hey, Sminty. Before you rag on Jackson for having Boromir continue to fight orcs even though he was struck by multiple arrows, you may want to reread TTT.

Tolkien didn't describe Boromir's battle to protect Merry & Pippin from the Uruk-hai. But in the book, Boromir was found near death by Aragorn surrounded by dead orcs and with multiple arrow wounds. So tell me how YOU would explain it differently that PJ. :D

[Huan]

I agree that the orc didn't die because of his total resolve to fulfill his mission for Isengard. What bothers me is not the orc, but Legolas. With all we see movie-Legolas accomplishing with that bow, how is it he didn't get an arrow right through that orc's eye?
Samwise, good job explaining deus ex machina, except for two things. One: deus ex machina more precisely means god OUT OF the machine, and two: it's actually a Latin expression. The Greek would be theos ek machenes.

[Claenoic]

Umm... Not enough practice with moving targets? :confused:

My sister and I saw it twice, and both times when it came up, we'd start humming the Olympics Theme song (you know, "Swiftius, Altius, Fortius"?)

My guess is, he was too scared of failing. Even though the orc probably knew it was a suicidal mission, he still didn't want to botch it, in fear of his masters. My opinion, of course.

[Cirdan]

Originally posted by Wayfarer
Deus Ex may weaken the plot in a novel, but it was one killer game. I reccomend it.

That was a good game! Torch blah, blah, blah...

[azalea]

Originally posted by Millane
he was a Berzerka nothing could have stopped him...
that scene was pretty cool but how much better would it have been if it had a scene before it with him getting hyped up and pouring some flammable liquid all over himself and setting himself alight and charging...
way better

Lol, that's good! And it would have been very "PJ.":)

[Gwaimir Windgem]

BB, I think you're being rather defensive. I don't think that was a put-down on PJ, but rather what she said: The same (or similar) force that kept Boromir going kept the Orc going, as well.

[Artanis]

Originally posted by Huan
I agree that the orc didn't die because of his total resolve to fulfill his mission for Isengard. What bothers me is not the orc, but Legolas. With all we see movie-Legolas accomplishing with that bow, how is it he didn't get an arrow right through that orc's eye?Good point. That bothers me as well.

[BeardofPants]

Originally posted by Wayfarer
Deus Ex may weaken the plot in a novel, but it was one killer game. I reccomend it.

Yes, very good. Or at least it would have been, if I weren't a complete scardy cat. *jumps at own shadow.* :rolleyes:

[Sylvee Estel]

Maybe Legolas couln't handle the pressure. Oh well it is nice to know he isn't completely perfect.

[ugo]

Before the impending battle Legolas gives advice to the other archers, saying something along the lines of:

"Their [the orcs] armour is weak around the neck and under the arm."

Keeping with his own advice Legolas manages to hit the 'olympic' orc in the neck and (as far as I can remember) around his armpit.

He didn't miss the orcs eyes because he wasn't aiming for them. Of course he *should* have been. Either that or the groin.

[crickhollow]

*cue Chariots of Fire theme music*
ehh, that's what I thought of the whole sequence, anyway. Actually, Helm's Deep was my favorite part.

And I don't think that Sminty was making fun of Boromir's death scene, BB. After all, doesn't Tolkien say that Merry and Pippin's last glimpse of Boromir is of him plucking out an arrow and continuing to fight?

[Millane]

nah ugo the orc that was running with the torch wasnt wearing armour coz he was a berzerka there the ones just wearing cloths
as i said the berserka was so nuts that not amount of arrows would have stopped him and as for why legolas didnt hit him in the eye well he was on top of the wall looking down so he wouldnt have been able to see any eyes...

thanks azalea at least someone recognises genius when they glimpse it :p

[Wayfarer]

Or at least it would have been, if I weren't a complete scardy cat. *jumps at own shadow.*

It's not even a horror game. :rolleyes:

[elendili]

btw I love your avatar!!!

isn't she gorgeous, Nephys the goddess of death

Maybe Legolas couln't handle the pressure. Oh well it is nice to know he isn't completely perfect.

:mad: :mad: :mad: you should be burnt at the stake, legolas is PERFECT

[Sminty_Smeagol]

Originally posted by Black Breathalizer
Hey, Sminty. Before you rag on Jackson for having Boromir continue to fight orcs even though he was struck by multiple arrows, you may want to reread TTT.

Tolkien didn't describe Boromir's battle to protect Merry & Pippin from the Uruk-hai. But in the book, Boromir was found near death by Aragorn surrounded by dead orcs and with multiple arrow wounds. So tell me how YOU would explain it differently that PJ. :D

I wasn't ragging on PJ... I meant nothing offensive toward him. But seeing as you seem to think I am "ragging" on PJ... are you suggesting it would be more appropriate I rag on Tolkien himself?

[Black Breathalizer]

Originally posted by Sminty_Smeagol
I wasn't ragging on PJ... I meant nothing offensive toward him. But seeing as you seem to think I am "ragging" on PJ... are you suggesting it would be more appropriate I rag on Tolkien himself? In response to why the orc didn't die, you responded: "Ummm the same reason Boromir was fighting off orcs after 3 arrows had hit him? And the same reason Aragorn fell off a cliff and came back the next day?"

Sounded like a slam to me. All I did was suggest that if it was a slam, you WERE slamming Tolkien himself. :)

[elendili]

if you think about it PJ really needs a biology lesson if you shoot someone once ok maybe they're bein brave but TWICE and still jumpin around killin orcs it sounds like artisitic licence to me

[Black Breathalizer]

Originally posted by elendili
if you think about it PJ really needs a biology lesson if you shoot someone once ok maybe they're bein brave but TWICE and still jumpin around killin orcs it sounds like artisitic licence to me I don't have the book in front of me to quote from. But I distinctly recall when reading the book that Tolkien gave the reader the impression that Boromir had put up a valient fight and, in fact, had many arrow wounds and orc bodies around him.

[LuthienTinuviel]

arrows take a while to kill the victims unless you hit anything vital the first time:

boromir's first arrow: hit above his heart, and with any luck only possible grazed a major artery

second arrow: "acgh! the spleen/liver!" (i guess that would be a spliver?):D

third arrow: lungs, this is what killed him, blood seeping into the lungs, that is why we see him swallowing blood and little in the corner of his mouth when aragorn finally gets to him.

so, the angle of the torch orc's neck arrow makes it seem like it would't kill instantly, but would be fatal, and what has ever killed anyone under thier arm?, so, as long as he could keep his mind clear from pain, he could most difinitly have carried out his task. boromir as well.



Sounded like a slam to me. All I did was suggest that if it was a slam, you WERE slamming Tolkien himself.

then why does your post tell her to stop raggin on pj?

BTW, don't be so defensive, bb... sheesh, uppity, aren't we?

[Black Breathalizer]

A grungy panhandler, Black Breathalizer, sits on a street corner on Wall Street in downtown New York. LuthienTinuviel, a female business executive dressed for success in a blue pinstriped suit and high heels stops near the poor guy while waiting for the street light to change.

(BB looks up at the woman.)

BB: Hey, babe. Can ya spare me a quarter?

LT: Get a job, you worthless bum!

BB: Hey, I ain't done nuthin'. Quit raggin' on me, toots.

LT: Me? Ragging on you? Don't be so defensive... sheesh, uppity, aren't we?

(The woman walks away in a huff.)

BB: huh?!?!

[cassiopeia]

From the Two Towers:
A mile, maybe, from Parth Galen in a little glade not far from the lake he found Boromir. He was sitting with his back to a great tree, as if he was resting. But Aragorn saw that he was pierced with many black-feathered arrows; his sword was still in his hand, but it was broken near the hilt; his horn cloven in two was at his side. Many Orcs lay slain, piled all about him and at his feet.
Arguments get boring when you start to rag people and not stick to the point you're trying to make. :)

[Wayfarer]

A grungy panhandler, Black Breathalizer

Is this a reference to your posts being factually and intellectually bankrupt?

Incidentally, your little scenerios are completely worthless. If your case had any merits than you wouldn't be constanly resorting to propaganda tactics.

[Black Breathalizer]

I'm just trying to have some fun. If you Purists would just relax and loosen up a little bit, you might have some fun too. :cool:

If Tolkien were still around he'd probably shake his head in disbelief at the way some of you people treat his stuff like a religion. Back in the 60s, he thought the Americans who became fanatical about his books were a bunch of goofballs. Not that I'm saying any of you people are like that! ;) :)

[Cirdan]

Wayfarer, are you jealous just because BB is far more insufferable than you? (j/k):)

Don't be as he is probably jealous of your cogent dialogs.

Arrows are aften portrayed as being more deadly than they are. Length of draw, bore, and bowstrength come in wide ranges of power. Legolas was an expert shot and likely to hit the "kill shot" target areas. I found it harder to believe the one shot kill of the warg, especially at that distance. Some animals will go into shock when hit, so it is possible.

[Millane]

Arguments get boring when you start to rag people and not stick to the point you're trying to make
NEVER!!!! this is boromir we are talking about i reckon he shoulda taken a few more the berzerka took 2 and was stumbling boromir has got way more strength than a berzerka... now if it was faramir on the other hand well i think he would faint at the sight of Lurtz;)
BTW Casseipea can you see more than 5 meters in front of you the smoke is shocking where i am

[LuthienTinuviel]

smoke? what happened?
are you all ok?:confused:

blue pinstriped suit and high heels

at least you could have dressed me better.:D
try camo skirt and black beater with a skull on it, thems are my favourite clothes!
and, FYI, i always give my pocketchange to bums. i don't have any need for it, and even if they are going to buy booze or scratchcards, at least their happy.
i really don't think that i did anyhting to deserve a satirical scene YET, either.. but im sure you'll come up with something just as mind-numbing sooner or later.

[cassiopeia]

There is some bad bushfires here in Australia at the moment. They arn't near close to where I live, but it is still very smoky here.
Sorry to be OT. :)

[BeardofPants]

Yup. All our sunsets are this weird shade of orange because of the way the light is hitting all the ash in the atmosphere.

[samwise of the shire]

One: deus ex machina more precisely means god OUT OF the machine, and two: it's actually a Latin expression. The Greek would be theos ek machenes. But Greek is the base of Latin so techincally it is a greecian expression. But the original Dues Ex Machina was a crane...probably fashioned after the first crane invented by Archedimes. Interesting stuff greek.
Um you guys I dont think taht Orc was a berserker...he was a KAMIKAZI. There's a huge difference though the similarities in fighting methods are similar. A berserker is usually veiwed as a Germanic warrior who goes crazy in battle leaping into battle, ignoring any wounds inflicted on them and crushing anybody who got in their way.
A Kamikazi on the other hand is someone who willing commits suicide during war for what they believe is right while killing thousands of people in the process. A good example would be the Japanese pilots who bombed Pearl Harbor or the World Trade bombers. From what I remember the orc wasn't fighting like a maniac...he was running to his doom to be blown to peices...a Kamikazi a suicide flyer or fighter. *shrugs* Maybe Huan can explain it better. ;) Have you studied Greek Huan? Or just latin?
Cheers,
Sam

[Millane]

no he was a berzerka thats what that type of Uruk were... yeah the berzerkas are just plain insane and thats why he got the job i guess... he wasnt the only berzerka there, there were others that got on top of the wall with those cool swords and started swinging them over there heads killing elves...

BTW BoP are there fires in New Zealand, (you are a Kiwi right?) or is it just smoke from australia??

[LuthienTinuviel]

that reminds me of ast year, or the year before, when there were all those fires in yellowstone, on the plane ride back we were flying just above the smokeline, and the air stank all the way down into salt lake city, it was weird, the fires were miles and miles away, but you still could hardly see anything.

ok. haha maybe i should be on topic. haha.

like i said arrows take a long time to kill, bullets rip and shred, but arrows (really depending on a few things, here) make holes.

[BeardofPants]

Originally posted by Millane
BTW BoP are there fires in New Zealand, (you are a Kiwi right?) or is it just smoke from australia??

We did have a fire down south somewhere, but it was the ash in the atmosphere from Canberra that was causing the discolouration.

Sorry, back to topic now, I promise.

[Millane]

hahaha thought i might aswell post it here. i decided to watch TTT again and i noticed Legolas doesnt shoot the Berzeker running with the torch at all... i sorta picked up that the arrows going into the berzerker were the Galadhrim ones, so i figured Legolas had ran out of his arrows and was using theres... then i went back and legolas was using his arrows...
so basically it looks as if he is just taking the credit for some classy Galadhrim archer and his shots were even bigger duds;)