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LuthienTinuviel
08-26-2002, 08:15 PM
Elves don't ride with saddles right?

So then why in the movie are the elves riding with saddles. Arwen's got one when ALL NINE riders are chasing her... and I thought in the preveiw for TTT i saw Leggy's horse with a saddle. And in some props picture I saw a labelled pic with "Elvish Saddle."
Hmm. Thoughts please.. why would someone change something like that, it does no good. Oh well.. discuss.:D
osszie
08-26-2002, 09:37 PM
I can guess because any stunt rider used for the movie only tell Pj where to get off, if he expected them doing that stuff without a saddle
cassiopeia
08-26-2002, 09:43 PM
You are right, Luthien. How about Aragorn with a beard. Doesn't it say in the UT that people with elvish blood don't have beards? I can't think of anymore at the moment.
Ñólendil
08-26-2002, 09:56 PM
cassiopeia, it does say that, however, if you would take a look at The Grey Havens chapter, you will find that CÃ*rdan is sporting a long beard. Tolkien's note about Elves being beardless is thus an error of sorts, or largely so. Somewhere in the Vinyar Tengwar (ask Tar-Elenion) it says something about Elves only growing beards when they are in the "Third Circle" of life, though no one knows what that is. I suppose only extreemly old Elves (like CÃ*rdan) grew beards.

In any case the Prince Imrahil and his family had much more Elvish blood than Aragorn, owing to their much more recent Elvish ancestor.
Blackheart
08-26-2002, 10:15 PM
Squirk...

You're worried about stuff like that and their digging Uruk out of pods in the ground?!!?
Starr Polish
08-26-2002, 11:12 PM
Well, if you look in FOTR, Glorfindel had a saddle on his horse.

Simply because you can doesn't mean you will.
Artanis
08-27-2002, 05:28 AM
What about Gandalf, he really should ride Shadowfax bareback. How is that in TTT trailers?

Else, I'm with Osszie. I don't know much about riding, but I guess riding without a saddle is real hard to learn. :)
Sween
08-27-2002, 06:55 AM
Have you ever tried to ride a horse bareback? Its vanya impossiable and do stunts as well. They probably could not get insurance to cover it.
LuthienTinuviel
08-27-2002, 11:34 AM
well blackheart, the pods didn't bother, but only confused me. like i said i was nitpickin, if you can't tell that by the title and content of this thread.
your probably right about the stunt riders.
and i never heard of that beard thing.. although i wouldn't picture elves with beards anyways.
Artanis
08-27-2002, 04:51 PM
Originally posted by Sween
Have you ever tried to ride a horse bareback? Its vanya impossiable and do stunts as well. They probably could not get insurance to cover it.
I'm sure you're right. It's just that Shadowfax in the book is so proud and independent, he wouldn't let anyone ride him but Gandalf, and never with saddle or bridle. Arwen and Legolas using saddles in the movie doesn't bother me much, but I feel it would be completely wrong to put a saddle on the great horse Shadowfax.
BeardofPants
08-27-2002, 05:42 PM
It's not that hard to ride a horse with no saddle. In some ways it's easier. Besides, I'm sure stunt riders could have managed it.

Now, if you want real nitpicking, just set me off on a tangent.... ;)
Starr Polish
08-27-2002, 05:50 PM
My mother used to be able to ride bareback, and how do you think the first domesticated horses where ever ridden? Certainly not with a saddle.
osszie
08-27-2002, 05:50 PM
Originally posted by Artanis

I'm sure you're right. It's just that Shadowfax in the book is so proud and independent, he wouldn't let anyone ride him but Gandalf, and never with saddle or bridle. Arwen and Legolas using saddles in the movie doesn't bother me much, but I feel it would be completely wrong to put a saddle on the great horse Shadowfax.

I coudn't agree more............hopefully they will have found a way:)
BeardofPants
08-27-2002, 06:04 PM
Well, the hardest thing about bareback riding, is getting ON the horse in the first place... especially if you're a shortass like me. ;)
Shadowfax
08-27-2002, 06:05 PM
Originally posted by BeardofPants
It's not that hard to ride a horse with no saddle. In some ways it's easier. Besides, I'm sure stunt riders could have managed it. Totally agree with you there; I ride (have been for 6 yrs), and I love going bareback:D and it is quite easy once you get the hang of it!

Oh and BoP (and others): here's a thread at another forum about how to mount a horse bareback! How to propell yerself onto a horse! (http://www.ultimatedressage.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=10210)
Sween
08-27-2002, 06:28 PM
Just watched the tralier again and it does look like Gandalf is bareback shame legolas isnt cos well thats just another thing that makes elves cool. But an argueement could be made not to make legolas too cool or we will get even more fan girls
Ñólendil
08-27-2002, 09:16 PM
Well, if you look in FOTR, Glorfindel had a saddle on his horse.

Simply because you can doesn't mean you will.

This is a mistake of Tolkien's, corrected in later editions. In the later editions, Asfaloth has a decorative headstall, but no saddle.
Starr Polish
08-27-2002, 09:54 PM
Really? I have to use the library's version, seeing as I don't have my own, and it's the "Hobbits 50th anniversary" version, and I recall it saying Asfaloth had a saddle.
BeardofPants
08-28-2002, 01:11 AM
The mistake is pointed out in Tolkien's Letters. Apparently Tolkien himself didn't notice it until a fan wrote in mentioning that it was odd that Asfaloth had a bridle and bit. Tolkien re-wrote that section, and replaced it with a head piece as Nolendil mentioned.
Blackheart
08-29-2002, 12:46 PM
Bareback isn't that hard. My third ex wife used to ride bareback all the time.

Yes on a horse also, smartypants.

Native Americans were also bareback riders.

Most people were until they invented saddles. Stirrups came a long time after that, and they greatly increased the efficiency of cavalry, as well as allowing things like lancers.

However, riding without a bit or bridle now.. that's a damned sight more impressive.
Shadowfax
08-30-2002, 01:43 AM
Originally posted by Blackheart
However, riding without a bit or bridle now.. that's a damned sight more impressive. There are bridles made specifically without bits that control the horse with pressure on the nose (they're called hackamore bridles); but yeah, without a bridle at all, that would be something!
BeardofPants
08-30-2002, 01:57 AM
Originally posted by Blackheart
Yes on a horse also, smartypants.
...

However, riding without a bit or bridle now.. that's a damned sight more impressive.

I wasn't gonna say any thing! :rolleyes: :D

I used to ride "Missy" without a bridle as well... Okay, so she wasn't exactly young and feisty, but still... she could give a good gallop once you got her going. :D
Sween
08-30-2002, 05:19 AM
whats a bridal? either way well done BoP i wish i wasnt scared of the things be cool to be able to ride a horse
LuthienTinuviel
08-30-2002, 12:07 PM
Originally posted by Starr Polish
Really? I have to use the library's version, seeing as I don't have my own, and it's the "Hobbits 50th anniversary" version, and I recall it saying Asfaloth had a saddle.

Maybe Glorfindel had a saddle because he knew that he might have to tow someone back to Rivendell... ya know, gettting ready for a worst case scenario kind of thing.
LuthienTinuviel
08-30-2002, 10:49 PM
wait, nevermind, upon closer inpsection the bloody pic DID have a ruddy saddle.......... grrrrrrrrrr
Kalimac
08-31-2002, 12:15 AM
This picture from the FOTR DVD shows Gandalf riding Shadowfax without a bridle or saddle:

Gandalf rides Shadowfax (http://www.warofthering.net/movies/photos/ttttenminute/images/PDVD_111.jpg)

And, here is a photograph of Gandalf and Shadowfax at Helm's Deep.
Gandalf and Shadowfax (http://www.warofthering.net/movies/photos/ttt/people/gandalf/irgimg/gandalfhelmsdeep.jpg)

Looks like, for the most part, Gandalf will ride Shadowfax without a bridle, bit, or saddle. Of course the actor or stunt rider may actually be in a saddle underneath all those robes . . but Gandalf will look like he is riding bareback.

As for the elves, and in particular Legolas . . I read that Orlando Bloom fell off his horse during filming and broke his rib. Maybe PJ had no choice but to film him riding with a saddle? Just a thought.

Incidentally, I grew up with horses and it is not difficult to ride bareback if you're experienced. Nor, is it that difficult to ride without a bridle if you know your horse, and he knows you. You can manuever and signal the horse with just a touch of pressure from your knees.

;)
Shadowfax
08-31-2002, 01:25 AM
On that first picture you can see a neckstrap around the horse's neck - for something to hold onto besides the mane. But that's great that there's no bridle! I just can't picture Shadowfax the great with one!
entss89
09-01-2002, 08:51 AM
i think that the actors would fall off without a saddle because thier not really elves you know.
Sween
09-01-2002, 10:42 AM
Originally posted by entss89
i think that the actors would fall off without a saddle because thier not really elves you know.

by your logic that makes BoP an elf.
Vorernil
09-01-2002, 10:59 AM
I was sorta-kinda-almost a little concerned about their animal casting in LOTR - just for a silly little example - Bill the Pony - maybe it's just because he didn't get enough screen time, but in the book he's meant to be about as smart as Sam (maybe not - well - certainly as smart as Pippin, at any rate!:D) - well, maybe I'm just stark raving mad 'cos I'm going on & on about the 'animal casting' in a movie . . . sorry!!!
Telperion
09-01-2002, 06:38 PM
Arwen might of had a saddle because she knew she would be pickong Frodo up and he couldn't ride bare-back? It's just a guess, I don't really know.:D
cassiopeia
09-01-2002, 11:18 PM
Arwen might of had a saddle because she knew she would be pickong Frodo up and he couldn't ride bare-back? It's just a guess, I don't really know.

I don't believe she knew that Frodo was stabbed.

i think that the actors would fall off without a saddle because thier not really elves you know.

Really? I thought they were. :D