Elvish Family Trees

[Willow Oran]

Does anybody know exactly how Glorfindel and Galadriel are related? Tolkien never says beyond the fact that they're members of the same house. But for that to be true they would have to be fairly closely related.

[Celandine]

I didn't know glorfindel and galadriel were related, but it probably says so in the book:)

[Radagast The Brown]

I really don't know where i read it, but i thought they were related too.... I'll look it. i hope I will find it.

[Sister Golden Hair]

In Robert Foster's Complete Guide to Middle-earth, he describes the House of Finarfin, and says that Gildor and Glorfindel were probably members of this house. However, this would be inconsistant with Glorfindel's location in the Silmarillion since he was an Elf of Gondolin and not Nargothrond. He could have been most likely of the House of Fingolfin instead of Finarfin, which would raise the issue then of golden hair color, which Tolkien does describe Glorfindel as having. If he is of the House of Fingolfin though, he would still be related to Galadriel and would have Indis' Vanyarin blood which would account for the golden hair. Trouble is, we do not know who his parents are and how they were related to the three houses of the royal lines of the Noldor.

[Willow Oran]

His location in the book does cause some problems doesn't it. He could have migrated to Nevrast and settled there before Gondolin was built and then just settled into the city with the rest of the people there.

[Sister Golden Hair]

But if he was of the House of Finarfin, it would have made more sense for him to settle in Nargothrond instead of Gondolin or Nevrast.

[Findegil]

Where is it said in the books that Glorfindel was in any way related to the house of Finwe at all?

Respectfully
Findegil

[Sister Golden Hair]

I don't recall that it says that in the books. I think this is an implication of a sort which is why I stated in my earlier post that Foster remarked on this. I think readers may assume that Glorfindel is related in some way to the House of Finarfin because of his high standing and golden hair color. Tolkien does say that he was a great Elven lord, but is this indicative of being a Finwean?

[Willow Oran]

According to Tolkiens descriptions he could only be a finwean, or a vanya. But the vanyar were the elves who were faithful to the valar, so if Glorfindel was a vanya then what was he doing in Middle earth?

[Ñólendil]

I think you are confusing "Finwean" with "Ñoldorin". The Finwëans were the Ñoldor of the House of Finwe. Glorfindel obviously was of Ñoldorin blood, but he was not necessarily related to Finwe, or descended from him.

As for the House of Finarfin, I don't see where he could fit in. That family is well documented. Finarfin's children were Finrod, Angrod, Aegnor and Galadriel. Finrod had no children, well, not before he died, and neither did Aegnor. Galadriel's only child was CelebrÃ*an, mother of Arwen. Angrod's son was Arothir (better known as Orodreth), and Arothir's children were Gil-Galad and Finduilas. They had no descendants and Glorfindel was not so young anyway. He was born in the Blessed Realm. Really if he was related to Finarfin then it was through Finarfin's mother Indis of the Vanyar. I suppose Glorfindel had Vanyarin blood and that would account for his golden hair. If he was of Indis's family, Ingwe's house, then it would explain Gandalf describing him as being "of a house of princes".

[Sister Golden Hair]

I thought I said that.:p

[Ñólendil]

You probably did. But I like to seem smart whenever possible. Thanks for ruining it, wrinkles. :p

[Sister Golden Hair]

luv you too little one.:p And I'm not wrinkled yet deary.:p

[Willow Oran]

Ah, thank you, that makes sense. Now to figure out just how he was related to Indis, If he was at all.

[Archbob the Elder]

In the least, they had a common ancestor in Finwe.

[Ñólendil]

Not necessarily. It would make sense if Glorfindel was related to Indis, grandmother of Galadriel, but they may not have been related at all.

[The Lady of Ithilien]

I don't know whether this clarifies anything or just confuses matters, but in "Of Tuor and the Fall of Gondolin" in The Silmarillion, Glorfindel (in his first incarnation) is called "chief of the House of the Golden Flower of Gondolin." Is that house mentioned anywhere else in the writings?

[Kirinki54]

Originally posted by The Lady of Ithilien
I don't know whether this clarifies anything or just confuses matters, but in "Of Tuor and the Fall of Gondolin" in The Silmarillion, Glorfindel (in his first incarnation) is called "chief of the House of the Golden Flower of Gondolin." Is that house mentioned anywhere else in the writings?

Someone, I think Michael Martinez, once explained to me that this is a remnant from very old writings, I think The Fall of Gondolin inhe Book of Lost Tales. I have not read any of those two volumes but there are supposed to be several Elf House names that does not really come into later myhology.

BTW Tolkien even experimented with the idea that Glorfindel might have been Sindarin - see Last Writings in PoME.

[Lefty Scaevola]

The House of the Golden flower is a military guild or order in Goldonlin. IN the fall of Goldolin , in the book of lost tales, there are describs several such militaray houses. The only ones named in the shortened version in SIL are the Golden Flower and the Fountain (headed by Ecthelion). His Princely status may be not from said military house, but may be hereditary, perhaps his is a descendent of Tatya, the second Elf or perhaps with his golden hair, he may have princely ancestery from the Vanyar.

[markedel]

As I understand it the only story of the fall of Gondolin is from BoLT-Tolkien wrote of Tuor's arrival to the city later but nothing else aside from a general descriptive outline.

[The Lady of Ithilien]

Now I understand where "Ecthelion of the Fountain" came from. Had known there were especially beautiful fountains in Gondolin and had supposed Ecthelion had them under his care (g), but he seemed more military than maintenance oriented.

Sorry that didn't help much in tracing Glorfindel's lineage. I had hoped maybe there was a reference to a certain family or other group that had been linked in some way to Glingal, the image of Laurelin behind Turgon's throne, or somewhere in the line back to Laurelin itself back in Valinor.

[Rían]

Glorfindel is just one of those mysterious loose ends ... I just love the description of him in FoTR when he is riding on his horse, looking for Aragorn, but even before Aragorn had moved or called, Glorfindel stops and looks up towards him. His whole sense of wisdom and power and courtesy (in the old-fashioned sense of the word) that comes thru in that section is really lovely. I'm kind of glad that he wasn't in the movie, because I can't image how they could have possibly conveyed all of that. Now I can just keep the image that I have of him in my head! (although I liked the movie in general)