if earendil had failed

[afro-elf]

if earendil had failed would the Valar have left morgoth to crush the elves, dwarves and men of middle earth?

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by afro-elf
if earendil had failed would the Valar have left morgoth to crush the elves, dwarves and men of middle earth? I think not. They may have not intervened when they did without Earendil's input, but the Valar had pity for the Exiles and never wholey abandoned them. I think they still would have done the same thing eventually, even without Earendil.

[Tar-Elendil]

the valar would have aided the peoples of middle-earth in time but im sure many woes great and small would have befell.

[Elvellon]

I believe Earendil was fated to succeed. It simply was de desire of Eru.

[elendili]

I think eventually the valar might have intervened due to the will of Ulmo but I think more of the Elves and Men would have died before that happened eventually the valar would have had to do something to save the Silmarils

[BeardofPants]

I dunno about Earendil being fated to suceed (sounds too much like a convenient plot device to me), but I do think that the intervention of the Valar was an eventuality that was inevitable... in due time. Just look at how much Ulmo interfered with the history of the elves. I think it was only a matter of time before he eventually conned some of the other valar to intervene...

[Elvellon]

Yet, in Tolkien’s work we see much of the same line of thought.
Weren’t elves bound by Fate? And consider how Bilbo found the ring; I remember that at one point Gandalf postulated that he may have been fated to find the ring. And that many things that happened to other “actors”, concerning the ring may have been fated to happen.

[elendili]

Tolkein says also about the fate of Gollum being tied up with the Ring but I don't believe in Fate especially coz there's no valar of fate

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by elendili
Tolkein says also about the fate of Gollum being tied up with the Ring but I don't believe in Fate especially coz there's no valar of fate No, but I think in Tolkien's world that fate came from Eru, and the Valar just helped keep it on course. When Tolkien speaks of the "doom" of certian people, like Beren, that is a fate. As far as there not being a Valar for fate, Mandos comes pretty close.

[Jador]

Dosn't fate tie in with the Music which was made at the begining of time?All of the Vaar and Eru were involved in this,but the Valar only really understood(and played)thier own part,and none of them knew the full mind of Illuvatar.

[Tar-Elendil]

anyways...
afro-elf said "what if." He was speaking hypothetically excluding the theories of earendil and fate. or i think so:P

[Radagast The Brown]

well I think that:

If Earendil had been failed another half man half elf person would go to Valinor and succeed. and if this man would fail too, the Valar probably would fight Morgoth anyway. But if they won't maybe they will let a half man half elf person to get to Valinor. And if it wouldn't happen.... well, that's another story. :)

[Ñólendil]

Eärendil's mixed blood and lineage is not what got him to Valinor. It was the Silmaril that his wife brought with her.

[elendili]

He also had the will to sail westwards and not give uo he wanted to stop Morgoroth so needed the valar's help, the Silmaril only helped him pass through the enchanted seas to Valinor