Celebrimbor: A Telerin Exile?

[Tim van Meter]

Am I right in thinking that Tolkien intended Celebrimbor to be a Telerin Exile? I can't remember the correct reference but I am sure that Celebrimbor is supposed to number amongst the companions of Celeborn and Galadriel when they fled Valinor following the Kinslaying. This change in his origins reflected Tolkien's developing thoughts about the etymology of his name (ie that the celeb stem implied a Telerin rather than Noldorin background). It would certainly explain why Celebrimbor was so chummy with Celeborn and Galadriel in Eregion. And would go some way to explain how the happy couple ostensibly managed to sail to Middle Earth all on their own. Can anyone help? Its not in the Silmarillion, but then so much isn't!

[Finrod Felagund]

Celebrimbor was the son of Curufin (son of Feanor) who repented of is father and uncle Celegorm's ways and staed in Nargothrond.

Tolkien I believe later on intended him to be of Gondolin but it never happened. Celeborn was by the way not a Teleri of Valinor but a Sindar of Beleriand. Thingol's nephew as a matter of fact.

[Ñólendil]

I am not familiar with all the various identities attributed to Celebrimbor by Tolkien. I do know that Tolkien always felt bound by what was his published in his life. As far as the Middle-earth books go this included The Hobbit, The Lord of the Rings, The Adventures of Tom Bombadil and The Road Goes Ever On.

In the Appendices to the Lord of the Rings Celebrimbor is said to be a descendant of Fëanor. Had Tolkien remembered he had said this, he would have felt bound by it, and he would have never written about a Celebrimbor from Alqualonde or a Celebrimbor from Gondolin or whatever.

That Celeborn was of the Amanya Teleri also shouldn't be accepted (in my opinion), because Celeborn is said to be a Sindarin Elf of Doriath in The Road Goes Ever On and the LotR Appendices.

Finrod, he was his grand-nephew.

[Tim van Meter]

Firstly, the story of Celeborn's princely origins in Aman, as Teleporno of the Telerin royal house, can be found in Unfinished Tales when Tolkien amends Celeborn's earlier histories. (Bear in mind that Celeborn is a Nando in LotR and a Sinda of Doriath in The Silmarillion). He leaves Valinor with Galadriel, independently of the host of the Noldor and together they seek refuge in Thingol's Doriath. This re-assessment of Celeborn's origins and of Galadriel's journey to Middle Earth reflected the development of the couple's later history and pre-eminence, and reflected in particular the need to disassociate Galadriel with the Noldor rebellion and the Kinslaying. Elsewhere, in his discussion of the height of elves and men, Tolkien refers to Celeborn as a Linda of Valinor, that is, one of the Lindar (Singers), as the Teleri of Aman called themselves. These later writings of Tolkien were not incorporated into the Silmarillion, in which Christopher Tolkien exercised a very great deal of editorial discretion. It is a re-assessment of Celeborn that goes a long way to equalising his status with that of Galadriel which makes a great deal of sense.

Celebrimbor is of course a Noldo in both the LotR and the Silmarillion, though he too has a somewhat varying descent. Tolkien's later work on his origins attached great importance to the etymology of his name, in particular the celeb stem that he shares with Celeborn. As I am sure you know, Tolkien took words as the first point in the development of his histories, and as his understanding of the languages changed, he changed histories to fit them. I am sure that some where, (and this is what I need help with!), there is a passage in which he decides that Celebrimbor is a Telerin silversmith, silver being that metal the Teleri prized most (see the Silmarillion). He adds that Celebrimbor came to Middle Earth as a one of the Teleri companions of Celeborn and his lover Galadriel. Celebrimbor was resident in Eregion, under the over-lordship of Celeborn and Galadriel, when he made the Rings of Power in the Second Age which suggests that he maintained his links with the couple.

Does anyone know whereabouts this reference to Celebrimbor's Telerin origins can be found?

[Finrod Felagund]

Nolendil, was right, Celeborn was Thingol's grand nephew but it was never put into the Silmarillion thet he was a Teleri. Remember, they're UNFINISHED tales. but ultimately he was supposed to have been a Teleri. In the unfinished tales, in The History of Celeborn and Galadriel, in the essay, The Elessar, Celebrimbor was to have become a Noldo of Gondolin (personally I like the grandson of Feanor story better and the Sindar version of Celeborn)

[Finrod Felagund]

The Teleri would not have had such a 'dwarvish' obcession with silver or such things as Celebrimbor did, he must have been a Noldor to have been so obcessed and skilled with the Rings etc.
Also he had great friendship with the dwarves which would make sense if he were a Noldo because both of those groups held him in such respect.

[Tim van Meter]

The Teleri did have at least some interest in gems and metalworking. Chapter 5 of the Silmarillion recounts how the Noldor made them gifts of pearls and pale gemstones (I think...) with which the Teleri were much pleased, while in an etymological discussion Tolkien tells us
In Quenya the [Telerin] form telpe became usual, through the influence of Telerin, for the Teleri prized silver above gold, and their skill as silversmiths was esteemed even by the Noldor. Thus Telperion was more commonly used than Tyelperion as the name of the White Tree of Valinor. Ufinished Tales

[Ñólendil]

Thanks for the detailed explanations. I don't go in for that knowledge about previous or later identities for Celebrimbor and Celeborn. I'm just not interested, as far as I'm concerned one was a Fëanorian and the other was Sindarin.

(Bear in mind that Celeborn is a Nando in LotR and a Sinda of Doriath in The Silmarillion)

I don't know about that. He was a Nando when the LotR was first written, but after the Second Edition the Appendices always made him out to be a Grey-elf of Doriath.

I am sure that some where, (and this is what I need help with!), there is a passage in which he decides that Celebrimbor is a Telerin silversmith, silver being that metal the Teleri prized most (see the Silmarillion).

It's in the Peoples of Middle-earth. I believe it is in Of Dwarves and Men, I'm not sure.

In my opinion it doesn't matter what the latest conception of Celeborn and Celebrimbor was, as Celeborn is said to be a Grey-elf of Doriath in The Lord of the Rings and The Road Goes Ever On, and in The Lord of the Rings Celebrimbor was said to be a descendant of Fëanor.

[Sister Golden Hair]

IMHO, Celebrimber was of the House of Feanor, a Noldorin Elf, and the son of Curufin.

[Tim van Meter]

The following passage is from "Dwarves and Men" Endnote Seven, Peoples of Middle-Earth.
...the name Celebrin-baur > Celebrimbor. This was a Sindarized form of Telerin Telperimpar (Quenya Tyelpinquar). It was a frequent name among the Teleri, who in addition to navigation and ship-building were also renowned as silver- smiths. The famous Celebrimbor, heroic defender of Eregion in the Second Age war against Sauron, was a Teler, one of the three Teleri who accompanied Celeborn into exile. He was a great silver-smith, and went to Eregion attracted by the rumours of the marvellous metal found in Moria, Moria-silver, to which he gave the name mithril...

This was the passage that I was looking for, and I thank Nolendil for pointing me in its direction.

I have been surprised at the level of resistance apparent to Tolkien's re-assessment of the origins of Celebrimbor and Celeborn. I have always found that part of the huge appeal of Tolkien's creative mastery has been its sheer range and fecundity - and that the published works are merely the the tips of the iceberg. It is possible, I think, to appreciate both. Plus I am very pleased that Tolkien thought about returning some of the Amanya Teleri to Middle Earth. They were, after all, that one of the Three Kindreds in Valinor who had most affection for Middle Earth. They tarried there longest, and left behind their distant cousins. Is it also not unlikely that there were some Telerin spouses amongst the exiled host of the Noldor?