Gandalf and Falling Damage

[Captain Stern]

As all of you have probably noticed, Gandalf's 'power' is ambiguous and inconsistant at best. He hardly ever uses his maiaric powers, and on those few occasions when he does it's usually when he or the fellowship is in danger.

The most confusing example of this to me is Gandalf's ability to survive the fall with the Balrog which was arguably many miles ( I know they landed in water but a fall from that height would snap anything in 2 and pulverise them into mush ) and his battle with the Balrog which sees them throwing each other off mountains e.t.c

Yet when Gandalf is 'trapped' on top of Isengard he doesn't dare jump off! It's as if he thinks that he would fall to his death like any normal person.

Does any one hold the answer?

[Ñólendil]

Gandalf remarked to the Three Hunters that the two foes were battling as they fell. Some folks (notably Michael Martinez, many agree with him) suppose that the Balrog may actually have been slowing the decent with something like flight, if it could fly or do something similar (to imagine this does not require wings either, if you don't think it had wings). The idea makes sense to me. Anothing thing to add to it is that Gandalf may have had great physical endurance like Elves or greater than Elves, not just in journeys of hardihood but in mishaps that would break the Mannish body. This latter idea is not enough to stand on its own, but it's good to add to the 'flight' one. Sort of like a bit of luck to save him from the pain of the landing, which is further lessened by the manner of the fall.

As far as Orthanc goes, even if he could survive the fall (he couldn't, I agree) there were many Orcs and Half-orcs and wolves housed in Isengard.

[Captain Stern]

That makes sense.

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As far as Orthanc goes, even if he could survive the fall (he couldn't, I agree) there were many Orcs and Half-orcs and wolves housed in Isengard.
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Could Orcs, Half-orcs and wolves pose a threat to a maia that could kill a Balrog? Or did his mannish form make him more succeptable to damage? ( And if that was the case how could he have possibly degeated a Balrog? )

[Wayfarer]

Almost any blow that would be enough to kill a normal humab would have neen enough to kill gandalf.

Mainly, he had great strength and endurance. So, he could easily lift a normal human off the ground. He also seems to have really good reflexes.

I really have no doubt that gandalf the grey could have been killed by orcs. Maybe not one on one, but the number that there were in isengard would have got him eventually.

[Wayfarer]

Or maybe falling damage hasn't been implemented in middle earth yet? ]: )

[FrodoFriend]

maybe in the fall and the fight with the balrog Gandalf discovered and used powers he didn't know he had. before, Saruman was more powerful than him. maybe then he would've died from a fall off of orthanc. but remember, after he comes out of moria Gandalf is changed. he becomes Gandalf the White, displaces Saruman and is generally more powerful. and it was the fight with the balrog that tested him. as Pippin put it, he "grew" somehow.

[CardenIAntauraNauco]

is it not probable that the highest tower of orthanc had walls on the side; unlike its depiction in the movie; not a very solid theory im afraid; just a thought

[Captain Stern]

FrodoFriend, you raise a valid point that I at least can't dispute...

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Originally posted by Wayfarer:
but the number that there were in isengard would have got him eventually.
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Can you seriously imagine all the Orcs and the Wolves in Orthanc managing to bring down Durin's Bane?

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Almost any blow that would be enough to kill a normal human would have neen enough to kill gandalf.

Mainly, he had great strength and endurance. So, he could easily lift a normal human off the ground. He also seems to have really good reflexes.
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How could an evidently weakened maia be able to kill one of the most powerful Maiar?

Hmm, I don't know... I think Im begining to fall into FrodoFriend's line of thinking on this subject.



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is it not probable that the highest tower of orthanc had walls on the side; unlike its depiction in the movie; not a very solid theory im afraid; just a thought.
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It's true that the movie made me think about all of this again. I'm not an expert on LOTR so I'll take you'r word for it that Tolkien was shady on the whole Istari subject. Then again couldn't an Istari have been able to blast it's way through almost any wall? seeing that they were Maiar and all.

[Lightice]

I remember, that Istari weren't allowed to use their true powers, but only powers existing at Middle Earth. Even Saruman didn't dare to break those orders.
However, they pretty much maxed powers Middle Earth could give to them, so they were much greater physically and mentally than any other residents of ME, without even mentioning possibilities of magic.

[crow]

Why should everything be entirely logical and comprehensible? Gandalf moves in mysterious ways. All of Middle Earth does, I daresay. Still, good question. Bear in mind that Isengard is Saruman's home and there is his power greatest. Furthermore, the discouragment of Saruman's betrayal would effect even the Grey Pilgrim.

[Strange-Looking Lurker]

Just a thought, but does anybody know exactly when Gandalf's body died? Could it be that his body was killed when he hit the body, and that he fought without it? Might this have perhaps freed him up some to be able to fight better? It does seem kinda strange that he had so much trouble with the Balrog by Balin's tomb, and then killed him later.

[Kevin McIntyre]

the istari's powers were not really limited, there were forbidden to dominate the people of ME, or use there power directly against Sauron. And much that they once knew need to be relearned. However when need be Gandalf did reveal himself, fighting the wolves he rose above all to change the outcome of the confrontation.




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In the wavering firelight Gandalf seemed suddenly to grow: he rose up, a great menacing shape like the monument of some ancient king of stone set upon a hill. Stooping like a cloud, he lifted a burning branch and strode to meet the wolves. They gave back before him. High in the air he tossed the blazing brand. It flared with a sudden white radiance like lightning; and his voice rolled like thunder.
"Naur an edraith ammen! Naur dan i ngaurhoth!' he cried.

There was a roar and a crackle, and the tree above him burst into a leaf and bloom of blinding flame. The fire leapt from tree-top to tree-top. The whole hill was crowned with dazzling light. The swords and knives of the defenders shone and flickered. The last arrow of Legolas kindled in the air as it flew, and plunged burning into the heart of a great wolf-chieftain. All the others fled.

Slowly the fire died till nothing was left but falling ash and sparks; a bitter smoke curled above the burned tree-stumps, and blew darkly from the hill, as the first light of dawn came dimly in the sky. Their enemies were routed and did not return.
"What did I tell you, Mr. Pippin? ' said Sam, she/thing his sword. "Wolves won't get him. That was an eye-opener, and no mistake! Nearly singed the hair off my head!"

- the ring goes south