Sauron and his ability to "seem fair" - question...

[Peter_20]

Alright, in the Akallabêth it's said that Sauron lost his fair and wise looks with the drowning of Númenor, "so he could never again appear fair and wise in the eyes of Men", but he still appears fair and wise during the chapter Of the Rings of Power And the Third Age.

What is this? :confused:
Is the Rings of Power chapter supposed to take place before the Akallabêth, or something?
Or did Christopher simply make a mistake? :D

[Butterbeer]

Not much of a super ability is it? I'd rather have someting like teleportation or invisability - or the ability to fly whilst hurling ice and fire :D

Nice to meet you Peter 20

[Valandil]

:
:
Is the Rings of Power chapter supposed to take place before the Akallabêth, or something?
Or did Christopher simply make a mistake? :D

There's overlap in time between the two stories. They each just focus on a different part of the story.

"The Akallabeth" briefly recounts the history of Numenor, from the start of the Second Age, to Year 3319 of that Age - when Numenor fell.

"Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age", after introductory information, really starts up a bit into the Second Age (the Great Rings were all made about the middle of the Second Age), and continues on up to the end of the Second Age (3441), tells how things were resolved from the Second into the Third, and summarizes accounts of the Third Age, especially as they involve principal opponents of Sauron - the remnants of the High Elves, the Kings of Arnor and Gondor, and the Istari - and on into a little recap of LOTR itself.

So - there's lots of overlap and interaction between the stories in the Second Age years - with the Numenoreans coming to the aid of Gil-galad against Sauron, Ar-Pharazon taking Sauron as hostage to Numenor and eventually being influenced by him to lead his forces to Aman (which of course, led to the downfall of Numenor) - and the flight of the Exiles of Numenor under Elendil.

[Olmer]

I did not see where it said about his fair look after the drowning of Numenor, but I think , that eventually Sauron would return his fair features.
Here is Wayfarer's thought on this subject.
If i am correct, then this is simply an outgrowth of the energy investment principle. I think that, when an ainur becomes incarnate, they must literally create a body for themselves, by turning energy into matter. And since a little bit of matter is equal to a whole lot of energy, this would be a huge expenditure. So once the body is harmed or destroyed, there isn't any reserve power to fix it or make a new one, and there's no way of getting back the power that's been invested.
(“The Silmarillion: Valaquenta.�) Wayfarer

My take is: the main idea of the Ring creation was to thansfer the energy back to the owner, as a reserve of power to resupply what might be lost. This way Sauron wanted to protect himself from the imminient future mishaps.

On another hand, is not it that "The Silmarillion" has been compilated from already written by Tolkien stories? So, poor Chris should not be blamed for whatever discrepancies, but the great author himself.
And concidering the author's words that the "Sil" has been written by men from different regions, it's natural that interpretation of the same story has some inconsistencies. :)

[Landroval]

My take is: the main idea of the Ring creation was to thansfer the energy back to the owner, as a reserve of power to resupply what might be lost.
I disagree - the main idea was to subdue the rings of the elves, and this was done at the expense of the security of Sauron and his power: the ring could be unmade, or the ring could get a new master. Either case would mean the reduction of Sauron to almost nothing. By making it he was not thinking about preserving his own power, but 'risking' it in order to subdue other's.

[Alcuin]

Sauron, like the other Maiar, could appear in a form appealing to Incarnates (Elves and Men, but also Dwarves, I think), or he could appear in a form repellant to them. He could also shape-shift, as he did when battling Huan the Hound of Valinor in First Age Beleriand at the original Minas Tirith: He shifted his shape to an enormous wolf in an unsuccessful attempt to kill Huan, then several other shapes in unsuccessful attempts to escape, then finally to a vampire bat to leave after surrendering the tower – and the imprisoned Beren – to Lúthien so that Huan would not disembody him.

This encounter with Huan might have been the original impetus for Sauron to forge the Ruling Ring: So long as he had his Ring, his native power could not be severely dissipated. Moreover, the Ruling Ring allowed him to see into the minds of those who wore the other nineteen Great Rings of Power, controlling weaker users (such as Men) and even the Eldar who wore them. (All the Rings were originally made for Elves in Eregion: Sauron just repurposed them after the War of the Elves and Sauron, when their makers and original bearers were killed or scattered.) Nor was shape-shifting unusual among the Maiar: it seems that even as an Istar or Wizard, Radagast the Brown retained that ability, because Gandalf says,“Radagast is … a worthy Wizard, a master of shapes and changes of hue.�

For Sauron’s appearance in Eregion as “Annatarâ€�, or “Lord of Giftsâ€�, he made himself appear physically and intellectually attractive to the Eldar. It is true that Gil-galad and Elrond denied him entry to Lindon, and Galadriel denied his claim to having been an Maia of Aulë in Valinor (he was, in fact, a Maia of Aulë, though long before Valinor he shifted his allegiance to Morgoth), but his appearance and demeanor tricked the MÃ*rdain of Eregion, the Elven-smiths. It was in this form that he surrendered himself to Ar-Pharazôn and the Númenórean invasion force, and so he remained in Númenor, poisoning the minds of those who would give him heed.

But in the destruction of Númenor, his body was destroyed, too. Eru, not the Valar, destroyed Númenor and changed the shape and nature of Arda, and so Sauron’s subsequent inability to again take on a form pleasing to Elves or Men was probably due to Eru: how, we are not told how, though “why� can be easily surmised. I suspect that he also permanently lost the ability to shape-shift at this point. Sauron was deposed again soon after, when Elendil and Gil-galad beat him senseless on the slopes of Orodruin and Isildur cut and took the Ruling Ring from his hand. When Sauron again assumed a physical body, his third in Arda, he could not generate a finger to replace the one Isildur cut off. Again, we are not told why, only that Gollum, who had seen him, reported this.

Gandalf told Frodo that Sauron placed the greater part of his native power into the Ruling Ring, and that as long as it lasted, he could not be vanquished. (A good example of this is the Wizard-king Koschei (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koschei) of Russian folktales, who places his soul into a physical container and guards it so that he might not die.) In this respect, Olmer (http://www.entmoot.com/showpost.php?p=582244&postcount=4) is correct. However, this was at great risk to himself as matters developed: the Númenóreans did not recognize his Ring of Power, nor is it likely they knew about them at all, for their nature and indeed their very existence was a secret among the Elves until the War of the Last Alliance, when Gil-galad at last revealed to Elendil what enabled Sauron to return. (That’s speculation on my part, but I think it fits the narrative very well.) The driving purpose behind Sauron’s taking such a risk was to subdue the Eldar to his will, and in this respect, Landroval (http://www.entmoot.com/showpost.php?p=582254&postcount=5) is correct.

I doubt Sauron ever imagined that his precious Ring could be taken from him until Isildur cut it from his hand and took it. The end of Númenor, the end of the Second Age, and the end of the Third Age must all have been great shocks to him. I suppose that could be Eru’s way of saying, Three strikes: you’re out!