New Tolkien book out next spring

[Draken]

Apparently. Don't know if anyone has posted about it yet, but I found this in today's Independent

Tolkien's son completes father's unfinished epic
By Andrew Buncombe in Washington
Published: 19 September 2006

All aboard for Middle Earth! Christopher Tolkien, son of the late, legendary creator of The Lord of the Rings, has completed an unfinished story started by his father which will be published next spring.

Mr Tolkien has spent the past 30 years working on The Children of Hurin, which his father began in 1918 and later abandoned. Though excerpts have been published this will be the first time a completed version of the epic story featuring the elves and dwarves of Middle Earth has appeared. It will be published by HarperCollins in the UK and by Houghton Mifflin in the US.

Mr Tolkien said: "It has seemed to me for a long time that there was a good case for presenting my father's long version of the legend of the Children of Hurin as an independent work, between its own covers."

Mr Tolkien, 81, who lives in France, has spent much of his life organising, deciphering and publishing stories of his father's that only appeared handwritten, often on scraps of paper. He has admitted that at times he has been forced to use guesswork to decide upon his father's intentions.

Despite this he has been a successful editor of his father's work and in 1977 he oversaw the publication of the novel The Silmarillion. This was followed by Unfinished Tales in 1980, and then the 12 volumes of The History of Middle-earth between 1983 and 1996.

His father's Lord of the Rings trilogy has sold more than 50 million copies and was made into a hugely successful series of Hollywood films, directed by Peter Jackson. Christopher Tolkien spoke out against the films, saying he believed the novels were not suitable for film adaptation.

All aboard for Middle Earth! Christopher Tolkien, son of the late, legendary creator of The Lord of the Rings, has completed an unfinished story started by his father which will be published next spring.

Mr Tolkien has spent the past 30 years working on The Children of Hurin, which his father began in 1918 and later abandoned. Though excerpts have been published this will be the first time a completed version of the epic story featuring the elves and dwarves of Middle Earth has appeared. It will be published by HarperCollins in the UK and by Houghton Mifflin in the US.

Mr Tolkien said: "It has seemed to me for a long time that there was a good case for presenting my father's long version of the legend of the Children of Hurin as an independent work, between its own covers."

Mr Tolkien, 81, who lives in France, has spent much of his life organising, deciphering and publishing stories of his father's that only appeared handwritten, often on scraps of paper. He has admitted that at times he has been forced to use guesswork to decide upon his father's intentions.
Despite this he has been a successful editor of his father's work and in 1977 he oversaw the publication of the novel The Silmarillion. This was followed by Unfinished Tales in 1980, and then the 12 volumes of The History of Middle-earth between 1983 and 1996.

His father's Lord of the Rings trilogy has sold more than 50 million copies and was made into a hugely successful series of Hollywood films, directed by Peter Jackson. Christopher Tolkien spoke out against the films, saying he believed the novels were not suitable for film adaptation.

[durinsbane2244]

man...i wish he'd do "The Lost Road"...:(

[BeardofPants]

*BoP dies and goes to heaven
*BoP remembers that she doesn't actually believe in heaven
Bugger

[Valandil]

It's a cool belief though, huh... if you could ever bring yourself to believe in it?

Anyway - that's interesting about the book. Also interesting that the press release mentions the "elves and dwarves of Middle Earth" - when I suspect the main protagonists will be Human (although of course we see lots of the other two groups - particularly elves).

[brownjenkins]

Very cool!

I wonder if it will be HoME-style (excerpts, clips and notes), or an actual finished story.

[Rosie Gamgee]

How can a guy, even if he is his father's son, say that his 'completing' of a man's 'abandoned' book is valid, and some director from New Zealand making a movie of a finished book by the same man isn't?

I don't know if I like the idea of it... I mean, yes, it's Tolkien, but how much of it is Christopher and how much is J.R.R.? In the words of Jeffrey Pelt: How are we to know the difference? Will it be noted which parts Christopher has had to fill in?

[BeardofPants]

Who cares - I just want a complete version of Narn i Hin Hurin. Added bonus if it doesn't completely suck ass.

[Earniel]

Cool idea but aaaww, why the Children of Hurin? That's my least favourite silmarillion-story. I bet I can wait another thirty years then, for a Fall of Gondolin novel. :(

<- is very spoiled fan and knows it.

Thirty years in the working! Christopher's as bad as his dad! :D

[brownjenkins]

How can a guy, even if he is his father's son, say that his 'completing' of a man's 'abandoned' book is valid, and some director from New Zealand making a movie of a finished book by the same man isn't?

I don't know if I like the idea of it... I mean, yes, it's Tolkien, but how much of it is Christopher and how much is J.R.R.? In the words of Jeffrey Pelt: How are we to know the difference? Will it be noted which parts Christopher has had to fill in?

You make a good point.

As I've said about movies as well, if the finished product is good, it doesn't really matter how much is the author and how much isn't. Sometimes directors even improve on an author's stroy. But, if it isn't good, it can be seen as tarnishing the author's legacy in some way.

A lot said that about the Silmarillion as well. Though, I'm happy that we have it as it is instead of not at all, or just in HoME-esk form.

We'll see.

[olsonm]

This is truly great! I can't wait! *dies and goes where ever BoP went* :)

[Gordis]

I think so far, Christopher did pretty well. Not like some movie-makers I could name.

It was only while reading the earliest book published by Christopher - the Silm- one could scratch one's head thinking what was JRR's and what Chris's. Already in UT, there are very few places whare there could be any doubt. (Even if some things were amended by JRR himself, Chris gave the latest version but commented on it).
As for HOME - all of it - I think it is very well written. There is no mixing the published JRR's texts with Cristopher's comments. I think Tolkien's son has learned his job well. There will be no problems with the coming book, IMO.

As for the subject... sigh... I so hoped there would be some texts left expanding the LOTR appendices! Maybe one day... But this term "last book" seems rather final, does it not?

[hectorberlioz]

Actually I was about to start a thread about the issue Rosie raised...

but I'll just say that editing his father's stuff seems to have become quite the hobby for Christopher... :p He's a great guy I'm sure, and has greater insight into Middle-Earth than we know...after all, he did tons to help his father with the maps, suggestions, editing...

[Gwaimir Windgem]

How can a guy, even if he is his father's son, say that his 'completing' of a man's 'abandoned' book is valid, and some director from New Zealand making a movie of a finished book by the same man isn't?

I don't know if I like the idea of it... I mean, yes, it's Tolkien, but how much of it is Christopher and how much is J.R.R.? In the words of Jeffrey Pelt: How are we to know the difference? Will it be noted which parts Christopher has had to fill in?

Because he is the living authority on the man's works.

[Gordis]

but I'll just say that editing his father's stuff seems to have become quite the hobby for Christopher... :p He's a great guy I'm sure, and has greater insight into Middle-Earth than we know...after all, he did tons to help his father with the maps, suggestions, editing...
I feel very grateful to Christopher for everything he has done. After all, the guy has spent half of his life trying to deshipher his father's manuscripts. He could have written his own stories, he could have spent his life playing golf or whatever, but he didn't. He had the insight to evaluate rightly his father's significance and the humility to put his father's legacy in front of his own interests.
Imagine, what it would have been like if Chritopher had no interest at all in his father's writings? It happens so often with famous men's children. We would have had LOTR and Hobbit and no idea about the rest of Middle Earth. Tolkien would hardly have become really famous. After all, as far as I know, his fame started not so much with the LOTR, but with Silm.

[Landroval]

After all, as far as I know, his fame started not so much with the LOTR, but with Silm.
Err, I certainly do disagree. Silmarillion was published in 1977, 4 years after Tolkien's death. In his letters 163 and 165, he comments of the unexpected success Hobbit and LotR had, for example.

[Butterbeer]

Kind of fitting Given Big J's thing about lineage and ancestry.

No, i see no issue whatsoever - after all we all here tinker with how his works are perceived everyday - look at the chapter by chapter discussion in the LOTR Discussion project - we to a small degree shape his work's perception as do any interpretations from art or drawings or radio or yes, movies.


good luck to Chris say I!

...has anyone ever invited him to come on here btw?

That'd be interesting. :D

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Err, I certainly do disagree. Silmarillion was published in 1977, 4 years after Tolkien's death. In his letters 163 and 165, he comments of the unexpected success Hobbit and LotR had, for example.

I agree. Far, far more people have read the Lord of the Rings than the Silmarillion. Nearly everyone has read the former, whereas the latter is sort of the first step of initiation in the Ranks of the True Followers, as it were. ;)

[Butterbeer]

true - but wasn't it the Sil that became hugely popular in the sixties in america?? :confused:

[Landroval]

true - but wasn't it the Sil that became hugely popular in the sixties in america?? :confused:
Bb, if the sixties is 1960-1969, then the book appeared afterwards :)

[Butterbeer]

... the sixties is a state of mind, man!


oh well, in that case Gor (as usual :p :D ) is talking **** again! ;) ... j/k Gor :) xx

[Gordis]

What I meant is that LOTR did not become very popular immediately - it took about 10 years. Well not 20, OK.
Here is what I am basing on:
http://www.fantasticmetropolis.com/i/tolkien/1/
I have little personal recollection of 50-ies or 60-ies :)

[Jon S.]

I dig Christopher completing his dad's books almost as much as I dig Dweezil Zappa playing his dad's music (which is to say "quite a bit"). :dude:

[Finrod Felagund]

this should be moved to Middle Earth

[me9996]

A few authors did that for Dr. Seuss, I do wonder how many people will wonder if tolken is still alive because of this (A person is smart, people are numskulls).

Anyway I don't think I'll read it, nothing against anyone but unless I spot it in a library I don't think I'll read it.

[Landroval]

What I meant is that LOTR did not become very popular immediately - it took about 10 years. Well not 20, OK.
Here is what I am basing on:
http://www.fantasticmetropolis.com/i/tolkien/1/
I have little personal recollection of 50-ies or 60-ies :)
Other websites, such as wikipedia, attest to LotR achieving cult status in the 60's. According to the letters, as far back as 1957, Tolkien received two propositions to make animated versions of LotR, and in 1958, there was Mr. Zimmerman's company trying to get him to do a movie.

[Nurvingiel]

Hm, perhaps when I'm done reading my current collection. (Still haven't read Unfinished Tales!) *ducks*

[Rían]

If he's going to tag on his own material from the point where his father left off, I don't think I"d like it ...

Is it going to be anything new from what we already have in our preciousssss little HoMe books? If it's more material from JRRT himself, I'd buy it, but if it's just Christopher's writing, then .... mergh .... ehh ....

[brownjenkins]

Because he is the living authority on the man's works.

Why? Simply because he is his son?

In some ways I think someone being a close relative might be a negative thing when interpreting another's work. There will be biases that might not exist with a more objective observer. You see this throughout HoME. Attempts to justify inconsistancies by JRR when, in fact, they were just that: inconsistancies JRR never really completely hashed out.

The only "authority" on a man's work is the person who wrote it. Anyone else has no authority and their conclusions are only as good as how widely the final product is accepted.

[BeardofPants]

Chris does have a bit more of an advantage though in the sense that he worked with his father (ME maps 'n ****) when he was still alive.

[Rosie Gamgee]

Why? Simply because he is his son?

In some ways I think someone being a close relative might be a negative thing when interpreting another's work. There will be biases that might not exist with a more objective observer. You see this throughout HoME. Attempts to justify inconsistancies by JRR when, in fact, they were just that: inconsistancies JRR never really completely hashed out.

The only "authority" on a man's work is the person who wrote it. Anyone else has no authority and their conclusions are only as good as how widely the final product is accepted.
Exactly!

However, for the record I will state that Christophers contributions to his father's published works are much appreciated. I do really like the fact that he got the Sil published, the Letters, etc. He's a great guy, and yes, possibly the only living person who can lay claim to being a bonafide authority on JRRT's stuff.

BUT; he's still not Tolkien, and I don't know about you, but I have no relatives that I would like to 'complete' a book that I myself decided to scrap after I'm dead. Maybe publish the snippets, but not finish on me. ...But that's just me. ;)

[brownjenkins]

I think Christopher did some great work as well, I just wouldn't use the "authority" word.

Of course, since his name is Christopher Tolkien, I guess it is a new "Tolkien" book. :D

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Why? Simply because he is his son?

In some ways I think someone being a close relative might be a negative thing when interpreting another's work. There will be biases that might not exist with a more objective observer. You see this throughout HoME. Attempts to justify inconsistancies by JRR when, in fact, they were just that: inconsistancies JRR never really completely hashed out.

The only "authority" on a man's work is the person who wrote it. Anyone else has no authority and their conclusions are only as good as how widely the final product is accepted.

Because he knew him. He knew how his mind worked. He has studied and pored over his manuscripts, compared the different variations and mutations of what he wrote. From my reading of the letters, it appears that he was also the closest of the Tolkien children to his father. I find that what biases there might be (minimal) would be far outweighed by his closeness to his father, and his understanding of him.

Unless, of course, you just want to contract Stephen King for the job.

The author is the best authority, but different persons are authorities on varying levels. Nolendil I consider an authority, Michael Martinez I consider an authority, and yes, fool that I am, I consider Christopher Tolkien an authority, as well.


However, for the record I will state that Christophers contributions to his father's published works are much appreciated. I do really like the fact that he got the Sil published, the Letters, etc. He's a great guy, and yes, possibly the only living person who can lay claim to being a bonafide authority on JRRT's stuff.

And therefore, he has much more justification in what he does than Jackson. Also, I assume he will not be changing it, merely filling in the gaps.

BUT; he's still not Tolkien,

Yes he is! :p ;)

and I don't know about you, but I have no relatives that I would like to 'complete' a book that I myself decided to scrap after I'm dead. Maybe publish the snippets, but not finish on me. ...But that's just me.

But being that he is his father's son, and that he is, as you admit, "possibly the only living person who can lay claim to being a bonafide authority on JRRT's stuff", don't you see that there is much more validity to his completion of an unfinished work of his father's, than there is in Peter Jackson's restructuring thereof?

[Rosie Gamgee]

But being that he is his father's son, and that he is, as you admit, "possibly the only living person who can lay claim to being a bonafide authority on JRRT's stuff", don't you see that there is much more validity to his completion of an unfinished work of his father's, than there is in Peter Jackson's restructuring thereof?
Yes, I can see where he would be more qualified. I can see where he would be the person to trust to get the work out as true to JRRT as possible. But the article seemed to indicate that Christopher has had to fabricate and fill in some spots that JRRT's fragments haven't explained. I'm not sure this sits right with me.
Again I will say, if I had a work that I had begun in life, then abandoned, deciding to move on to other things, I'm not really sure I would want anyone, after I was dead, to complete it for me. Even if I told them where I was going with the story, or what the general idea was, I don't feel that I could trust them to finish my stuff and release it under my name.
But I'm protective of my writings/other works. So maybe JRRT would feel differently. At any rate, I'm not trying to sit here and flame Christopher. I might even read the thing, when it comes out.

[hectorberlioz]

There's a similar debate with Mahler's uncompleted 10th Symphony. What there was finished was performed, but some scholars took it upon themselves to finish the work...most famously Deryck Cooke. A lot of Mahler champions, including Bruno Walter and Otto Klemperer, who had worked with Mahler; were against the idea.

There are about three or four "versions" circulating around, and none of them of course, sound anything like what Mahler would have done....

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Yes, I can see where he would be more qualified. I can see where he would be the person to trust to get the work out as true to JRRT as possible. But the article seemed to indicate that Christopher has had to fabricate and fill in some spots that JRRT's fragments haven't explained. I'm not sure this sits right with me.
Again I will say, if I had a work that I had begun in life, then abandoned, deciding to move on to other things, I'm not really sure I would want anyone, after I was dead, to complete it for me. Even if I told them where I was going with the story, or what the general idea was, I don't feel that I could trust them to finish my stuff and release it under my name.
But I'm protective of my writings/other works. So maybe JRRT would feel differently. At any rate, I'm not trying to sit here and flame Christopher. I might even read the thing, when it comes out.

Maybe I'm missing it, but I don't see where the article says Tolkien 'abandoned' Narn i Hin Hurin.

[hectorberlioz]

I have to say, Gwai has pretty much spelled it out...

Christopher is most definitely Tolkien...

[Rosie Gamgee]

LOL. Yes, he is Tolkien. :)

Maybe I'm missing it, but I don't see where the article says Tolkien 'abandoned' Narn i Hin Hurin.
A-a-hem:
Mr Tolkien has spent the past 30 years working on The Children of Hurin, which his father began in 1918 and later abandoned. Though excerpts have been published this will be the first time a completed version of the epic story featuring the elves and dwarves of Middle Earth has appeared...
Nevertheless, I am probably over-using the word. ;)

[Gwaimir Windgem]

*stands corrected*

[Butterbeer]

Not at all Gwai - stand Proud!!

Lovely lass as we all agree Rosie is - when she errs - and badly as here - do not let one careless word from god knows what "authority" let you take 30 ..yes THIRTY YEARS of BOTH TOLKIEN'S life and work away from you.

hardly rushed or ill-concieved is it?

How old is he? ..Hardly for the money or the fame ...

Tis, in like to his father, for the joy of it.

30 years ...we are not talking Mills and Boon here for F's sake.

Poppycock!! say I to the lovely Rosie ....Poppycock me dear!

[Gwaimir Windgem]

You are quite right, of course, BB. I did not for a minute give up my support of ol' Chris in this endeavour. I just stood corrected on the question of the work being 'abandoned'.

[Rosie Gamgee]

Not at all Gwai - stand Proud!!

Lovely lass as we all agree Rosie is - when she errs - and badly as here - do not let one careless word from god knows what "authority" let you take 30 ..yes THIRTY YEARS of BOTH TOLKIEN'S life and work away from you.

hardly rushed or ill-concieved is it?

How old is he? ..Hardly for the money or the fame ...

Tis, in like to his father, for the joy of it.

30 years ...we are not talking Mills and Boon here for F's sake.

Poppycock!! say I to the lovely Rosie ....Poppycock me dear!

30 years, yes. Maybe he procrastinates.... :p

You're right; thirty years isn't something to be sneezed at.

[Valtir]

I don't fully understand the attention payed to Turin. Sure, it's a tragedy, and truly powerful at times, but we've already seen longer versions of the tale.

How about some love for Beren?

[Rían]

You are quite right, of course, BB. I did not for a minute give up my support of ol' Chris in this endeavour. I just stood corrected on the question of the work being 'abandoned'.Don't stand corrected yet - WHO was that quote from? Anyone can say Tolkien "abandoned" a work! Perhaps the person that used that word thinks that it was Arwen that helped Frodo at the Ford ... :eek: ;)

*cheers Gwai on* ;)

[Gwaimir Windgem]

:eek:

You're right, that is possible. But in lieu of evidence to the contrary, I will assume the author of this article was speaking out of the correct orifice.

[Khadrane]

Wow, this is really cool news to me. Being a sucker for a good tragedy, I love the story of the Children of Hurin.

About whether or not the words are J.R.R. Tolkien's, here's an interview that the Spanish Tolkien Society had with Adam Tolkien. Apparently the writing is all good ol' Ronald.
Interview with Adam Tolkien (http://www.fantasymundo.com/articulo.php?articulo=439)
The interview is in English at the bottom of the page, by the way.