HP1- Chapter5- Diagon Alley

[Serenoli]

Chapter Five, Diagon Alley, opens with a half-asleep Harry, convinced that everything that had happened was a dream. Luckily for him, and for us, it wasn’t. A knocking owl wakes him up, and soon, he and Hagrid are on their way to Diagon Alley.

The main events that occur are as follows:

-They travel to the Leaky Cauldron in London, where we meet Professor Quirrel, t-the n-n-nerv-vous DADA teacher, and then to Diagon Alley itself.
-The trip to Gringott, to get Harry’s gold, and the all-important ‘small grubby package’.
-Madam Malkin’s to get school robes, and make the acquiantance of Draco Malfoy.
-Parchment, inks, the introduction of Quidditch, cauldrons, scales, phials, apothecary and all the rest. Then, finally, Hedwig the snowy owl, and a wand at Ollivander’s.
-Once they’re done, they leave the Leaky, have a hamburger, and after giving Harry the Hogwart’s train ticket, and handing him into another train to get back to the Dursleys, Hagrid leaves.

A highly enjoyable chapter, in fact. Diagon Alley effectively summarises the wizarding world for us, hands it to us in a nutshell, giving us loads of information ranging from hags to broomsticks disguised as a shopping trip. Did anyone else love the names of the school textbook authors? :D Switch writes transfiguration, and Spore gets the herbology book, and of course, Magical Theory is written by Waffling. A very humourous chapter, with lots of little jokes everywhere.

But, as always, clues everywhere as well. Meeting Quirrel, who’s there to rob Gringotts, and the Philosopher’s Stone. Poor Harry, he didn’t know the title of the book, or he might have figured out what the package contained at once. When you first read it, what did you think the all-important package contained?

Then Hagrid mentions dragons, and how he’d always wanted one. More foreshadowing.

Discussion points:

What are your first impressions of the wizarding world from Diagon Alley? How is it different from your expectations gotten from reading the first four chapters?

What was the point of Ollivander’s measuring tape? As far as I saw, he handed him completely random wands, with little in common…

And the appropriate thread for the question: how DID the Dursleys get home?

Do you think any of the folk from the Leaky Cauldron will make any appearances in the 7th book? Or were they just extras?

Also, how does Hagrid fly? Maybe he came on that bike of Sirius', because I've never seen a broom near him... but other than the first chapter, I've never seen the flying motorcycle either. Any ideas where that could be?

And, this is obviously something we wont know on our first reading, but any theories on how Quirrel/Voldy managed to get in the vault without getting sucked in and being trapped for ten years?

I’ve written this on very short notice, and because I’m anticipating my A level results tomorrow :eek:, I can’t even postpone and take time to hone it better, so forgive me for the shortness, or the lamentably low number of discussion points I could think of… If I can think of more, I’ll come back and post. Meanwhile, enjoy! :)

[durinsbane2244]

brilliant job, serenoli!

this chapter is what made me pick up HP, when it was read to my class in school.

as to the wands, i think that he was just trying to see what kind of wand suited harry, as his father's favored transfiguration and his mother's charms, we see that wands vary.

[jammi567]

No, no, this is perfect. Short and to the point, with enough discussion points to keep us going for a while. Hopefully. Of course, people can add to them.

Before i start answering the questions, here's (http://www.hp-lexicon.org/atlas/britain/atlas-b-diagon.html) a map of Lexicons interpritation of what Diagon alley looks like.

1) Upon first reading, especially to younger kids, you do expect wizards to be those people who pull rabbits out of hats, and witches as ugly things, all green and warty, riding broomsticks and such like.

2) On this, i have no idea.

3) Maybe the Dursleys were expected to stay one night at that hut, and return in in the morning, so when they didn't the old man went to them in a boat to pick them up. Maybe.

4) i can't remember now, but weren't some of them original Order members, and so possibly stationed around London to help keep an eye on both Harry, and the Dursleys.

5) Maybe he arrived by Porkey, although it doesn't answer why it took him 5 minutes to get to the hut (see previous chapter thread). With the 'cycle, maybe the castle has a garage for magical vercles. :)

6) Since when has Voldy cared about his follower's health, so long as they did as he asked. Especially to someone he barely knows.

[Serenoli]

Thanks, durinsbane and jammi.

6) Since when has Voldy cared about his follower's health, so long as they did as he asked. Especially to someone he barely knows.

Thats all very well; but if Quirrel got sucked in, Voldy wouldn't get the Stone, which he does CARE about. And Quirrel was his only ally right then; he's meaner than a ghost, is Voldy, and afraid of his own followers. Of course he'll want to keep Quirell around until he has a chance to get his life back.

[jammi567]

i don't know then. Maybe to say that he was getting the stone for dd.

[Serenoli]

ten years later?

[jammi567]

10 years later from what? :confused:

[Serenoli]

well, Griphook the goblin said that if anyone other than a Gringotts goblin tried to open the door of the vault, they'd be sucked into the vault; and that they only checked every ten years to see if anyone was in there; although the last bit is quite possibly a joke.

Anyway, it'd be a bit of a lame story anyway, and they wouldn't PLAN to get caught, would they? And, obviously, Quirrel, (and Voldy... not sure if he was already in the head), though he missed the Stone, must have found a way to get in, and after breaking in, he also got clean away. How?

[Serenoli]

brilliant job, serenoli!

this chapter is what made me pick up HP, when it was read to my class in school.

as to the wands, i think that he was just trying to see what kind of wand suited harry, as his father's favored transfiguration and his mother's charms, we see that wands vary.

And Voldy's wand favoured power; as Ollivander says, powerful wand. :rolleyes:

By the way, I never really saw any reference to Harry's wand prefering any specific kind of magic... I mean, how can you tell? Unless of course, his wand is good for defensive spells, as in DADA.

[jammi567]

To your first post, i recon that was the original plan (go in, and claim he was getting the stone to put in the maze to protect it from voldy). But that went wrong when Harry and Hagrid got to it first. But i have no idea how he managed to do it, and at this stage of the series, we probally never will.

To your second post, i agree. Another issue to do with this wands is: why mention that it was specifically one of Fawk's tail feathers? And how common are phionixes anyway?

[jammi567]

Anyone else?

[Serenoli]

He doesnt really mention Fawkes. Only that Harry and Voldy share wand-cores, which is a pretty strange fact, and no reason why Ollivander should keep it a secret, is it? We only find out its Fawkes in book4. But its cool, isn it, how she's setting the foundation for all the future books here, in small ways like this? I mean, without the wand-core sharing thing, Harry couldnt escape Voldy in GoF.

BTW, what you said about Hagrid coming by Portkey... well, that wouldn't technically be flying, would it? And the thing is, whatever he used to fly to the hut, wasnt there the next morning....

[jammi567]

Could've flown on a thestle (sp) possibly.

[durinsbane2244]

actually, the sensation of portkey is described to be somewhat like flying... :D

[Lizra]

The wizarding world seemed rather old fashioned....or stuck in a time warp....maybe it's the longer life span...or do wizards have longer life spans? Anyway, nobody seems too modern or hip.....

[Serenoli]

the thestral idea seems pretty cool... after all, Hagrid grows them, Harry wouldnt be able to see them, and they are very good with locations, so that could be how Hagrid found out where the Dursleys were.

[jammi567]

Thestral it must be, from what we can deduce.

[durinsbane2244]

that is a good point made my lizra, though. do wizards live longer? in most fantasy, they do, and DD was just a tad elderly... ;)

[jammi567]

It's estimated that they live around 90-120 years.

[Butterbeer]

The wizarding world seemed rather old fashioned....or stuck in a time warp....maybe it's the longer life span...or do wizards have longer life spans? Anyway, nobody seems too modern or hip.....


oh, i don't know, ol' Voldemort seems quite in tune with the times ... mudbloods and muslims and profiling and whatnot ... ;)

Big Bal:
that is a good point made my lizra, though. do wizards live longer?

hey! ... hand's orf! ... she's mine ... get ya lascivious paws off the beautiful Lizra

best, BB ;) :)

[Lizra]

hey! ... hand's orf! ... she's mine ... get ya lascivious paws off the beautiful Lizra

best, BB ;) :)

Heh! :D
Hey! You! BB.....Come here! :p I'd like to smell your cologne...... ;) Mmmmmm! :cool:

[jammi567]

Ohhhh, no more discussion. Anything else we can add? Or reply to?

[Nurvingiel]

Great summary and discussion points Serenoli. I hope you did well on your A levels (and get lots of OWLs. :D )

What was the point of Ollivander’s measuring tape? As far as I saw, he handed him completely random wands, with little in common…Shows what you know about the fine art of choosing someone's wand. ;)

I think from Rowling's perspective, the measuring tape adds more depth and mystery to the magical world. From Olivander's perspective, I think it gives him data that helps him choose wands. For example, maybe different wand materials are attuned to different dimensions of the human body? Maybe the length of the arm is important for a wand with a unicorn hair core, but the circumference of your head is important for oak wands?

I also find it interesting that the two wand materials, aside from whatever magic goes into making them, are a core of part of some magical being (unicorn hair, dragon heart string) and wood for the "body" (oak, and I'm sure all other trees native to Britain).

And the appropriate thread for the question: how DID the Dursleys get home?Roadside assistance. :D

Do you think any of the folk from the Leaky Cauldron will make any appearances in the 7th book? Or were they just extras?They'll add to the body count. :evil:

Also, how does Hagrid fly? Maybe he came on that bike of Sirius', because I've never seen a broom near him... but other than the first chapter, I've never seen the flying motorcycle either. Any ideas where that could be?I think he Apparated; I don't think you need a wand to do that. Otherwise, maybe he just took the train. Aren't there a few instances where wizards took Muggle transit? Or maybe he took the Knight bus. (Would it stop for a pink umbrella?)

And, this is obviously something we wont know on our first reading, but any theories on how Quirrel/Voldy managed to get in the vault without getting sucked in and being trapped for ten years?I'm sure there's some way to break every charm or spell. Lily Potter circumvented an Unforgiveable Curse, I'm sure a talented wizard with a lot of time on his hands like Moldy Voldy could get around a layer of security charms.

He also could have used Legilimens on a guard to get needed passwords, had an agent inside the bank, or used the Crucio curse to make one of the goblins open the vault for him, followed by a really good memory charm.

There's one evil wizard with a disappointingly large amount of resources.

[Serenoli]

He also could have used Legilimens on a guard to get needed passwords, had an agent inside the bank, or used the Crucio curse to make one of the goblins open the vault for him, followed by a really good memory charm.

Or perhaps Imperius? Easier than Crucio, no noise, you know. And, how come they discovered the theft? I mean, the goblins knew the vault had been emptied that day, so obviously they wouldn't be checking on it. Unless the memory charm (on Cruciod/Impeurised goblin) was faulty, how could they know of the robbery? I mean, if you did use a gringotts Goblin, any Secrecy Sensors, (or that spell Umbridge used on her office) wouldnt be triggered. It really sounds like Q-Voldy somehow forced the door open, and that was discovered.

BTW, would Quirrel-Voldy have all of Voldy's powers? I mean, he only went away for a year, according to Hagrid, would he have time to learn all the Unforgiveables?

And, another interesting bit about Quirrell. Now, considering the jinx on the DADA position, this should Quirrel's first year teaching in Hogwarts. But when Hagrid talks about him, its like Quirrel was there before. Notice all the 'scared of his own students' stuff. Now Hagrid may have met the new teacher, but unless he's actually seen Quirrel around Hogwarts, how was he supposed to know all that? (He also hasnt seen Quirrel much after coming back from that trip of his, did he? I mean, it must have been the year just before, surely) Any explanations?

As for the flying, Hagrid tells Harry he flew, which is obviously not the same as Apparating. I mean, he probably didnt fly all the way, but he seems to have flown to the island from the mainland at the least.

[Nurvingiel]

You know what else I love about this chapter? Diagon Alley = Diagonally :cool:

Or perhaps Imperius? Easier than Crucio, no noise, you know. And, how come they discovered the theft? I mean, the goblins knew the vault had been emptied that day, so obviously they wouldn't be checking on it. Unless the memory charm (on Cruciod/Impeurised goblin) was faulty, how could they know of the robbery? I mean, if you did use a gringotts Goblin, any Secrecy Sensors, (or that spell Umbridge used on her office) wouldnt be triggered. It really sounds like Q-Voldy somehow forced the door open, and that was discovered.Oh yes, Imperius would have worked very well for their purposes. Maybe they used Imperius to get to the vault, but had to force the door open at the end.

BTW, would Quirrel-Voldy have all of Voldy's powers? I mean, he only went away for a year, according to Hagrid, would he have time to learn all the Unforgiveables?Heck, Harry knows all the Unforgiveables and he hasn't even graduated yet. I don't think be-turbaned Quirrel would have all of Voldemort's powers. I think the progression of the books shows us that, how Voldemort gains power each time he gets closer to a real body.

Dear Voldemort,
Just... die already.
Love,
Harry

And, another interesting bit about Quirrell. Now, considering the jinx on the DADA position, this should Quirrel's first year teaching in Hogwarts. But when Hagrid talks about him, its like Quirrel was there before. Notice all the 'scared of his own students' stuff. Now Hagrid may have met the new teacher, but unless he's actually seen Quirrel around Hogwarts, how was he supposed to know all that? (He also hasnt seen Quirrel much after coming back from that trip of his, did he? I mean, it must have been the year just before, surely) Any explanations?Maybe he wasn't "scared of his own students" in the sense that he was scared of his students from last year, but just that he was scared of everything, including his newly acquired class?

As for the flying, Hagrid tells Harry he flew, which is obviously not the same as Apparating. I mean, he probably didnt fly all the way, but he seems to have flown to the island from the mainland at the least.Oh. I got nothing then.

But you also don't need a wand to fly a broomstick. Hagrid would be a perfectly good wizard if his wand wasn't in pieces. If I was Hagrid I'd buy another wand and do magic on the sly, but maybe he promised Dumbledore he wouldn't do that. It's not like Hagrid has a problem breaking rules though, typical Gryffindor. :D

[jammi567]

And, another interesting bit about Quirrell. Now, considering the jinx on the DADA position, this should Quirrel's first year teaching in Hogwarts. But when Hagrid talks about him, its like Quirrel was there before. Notice all the 'scared of his own students' stuff. Now Hagrid may have met the new teacher, but unless he's actually seen Quirrel around Hogwarts, how was he supposed to know all that? (He also hasnt seen Quirrel much after coming back from that trip of his, did he? I mean, it must have been the year just before, surely) Any explanations?
Quirril had a year there (when it was the twins first year). He then couldn't cope with something, and so left after that year to get some more experiance. After that, he came back, and taught again in Harry's first year. For more info,click here (http://www.redhen-publications.com/QuirrellDebacle.html).