Favorite Fortress

[Haradrim]

There are many fortresses in ME but what is your Favorite fortress ie-Minas Tirith, Dol GOldur, and so on. I have to go with Erebor. I loved the hobbit. Not more than LOTR but I loved the descriptions of it in its glory days also I love how close it is to Dale, my favorite city in Middle Earth.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Well, I love all things Finrod. So my favorite fortress would be the underground fortress of Nargothrond. :)

[Haradrim]

Nargothrond was my second choice. But I stil have to go with Erebor. IT was my first real fortress as I read Hobbit first so I have a special connection with it

[BeardofPants]

Possibly Menegroth... With Gondolin a close second. Oh, and Angband. :p

[Earniel]

Not really a real battle-fortress like the first Minas Tirith persay, but still a place that could stand strong and be locked against an enemy, so I choose Menegroth. Possibly because I once saw a gorgeous drawing of it and the description:

[...]Beyond the gates wide passages ran down to high halls and chambers far below that were hewn in the living stone, so many and so great that that dwelling was named Menegroth, the Thousand Caves. But the Elves also had part in that labour, and Elves and Dwarves together, each with their own skill, there wrought out of visions of Melian, images of the wonder and beauty of valinor beyond the Sea. The pillars of Menegroth were hewn in the likeness of the beeches of Oromë, stock, bought, and leaf, and they were lit with lanterns of gold. The nightingales sang there as in the gardens of Lórien; and there were fountains of silver, and basins of marble, and floors of many-coloured stones. carven figures of beasts and birds there ran upon the walls, or climbed upon the pillars, or peered among the branches entwined with many flowers. And as the years passed Melian and her maidens filled the halls with woven hangings wherein could be read the deeds of the Valar, and many things that had befallen in Arda since its beginning, and shadows of things that were yet to be. That was the fairest dwelling of any king that has ever been east of the Sea.
...just says it all, doesn't it?

*dreamy, happy sigh*

[Haradrim]

Is that quote from the SIlmarillion?

[Earniel]

Yes, from chapter 10: Of the Sindar.

[Haradrim]

okay copool I am just about to get there. You know if Erebor wasnt my favorite I wouldnt go with Nargotthrond. I think I would have to go with Moira. It was a fortress in its day. A darn big one too. And they never were successfully atacked from the outside they just unleashed a Balrog right iun their midst. So I have to say Erebor- 1 and Moria- 2

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

I quite like Helms Deep. I mean it was meant to be built by giants but I'd have to say that or Moria is my favourite.

[Haradrim]

Hmm I just noticed that I have a liking to dwarves a lot. hmmm... though I usually dont like dwarven characters except in the Hobbit an LOTR. Thats odd. In every other fantasy book Ive read I hate the dwarves. I wonder why?

[trolls' bane]

Valinor, I'd have to say. If the mountains count as walls, like their described in The Sil (at least that's how I took it).

[Attalus]

Khazad-Dûm. I'd love to have visited when Durin was King and when the Dwarves were young and strong. ;)

[Draken]

I have a problem with Helm's Deep. Why carefully place the main keep on a spur behind a bend in the stream (in the book that is, the geography was different in the film) and then build a nice, wide, gentle ramp right up to the front door? There wasn't even a drawbridge to make things a bit difficult for any attacker!

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Yeah but it was built by giants.

[brownjenkins]

rivendell... good food, drink and company :D

in war, probably gondolin

[Valandil]

Yeah but it was built by giants.

Really? Where do you read that?

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Tolkien illustrated Encyclopedia or at least it said something about giants helping the Dunedain build it.

[Valandil]

Tolkien illustrated Encyclopedia or at least it said something about giants helping the Dunedain build it.

General rule of thumb: If Tolkien didn't say it, it's mere speculation. I don't believe he authored that particular work, did he?

[Attalus]

rivendell... good food, drink and company :D

That's where I'd have my winter home. ;)

[trolls' bane]

General rule of thumb: If Tolkien didn't say it, it's mere speculation. I don't believe he authored that particular work, did he?
I remember reading that somewhere in the book, too. I think he did say that it was told that it was built by giants, meaning that it probably was true, but you know those M-Etians. They never tell the person who's writing about them the full story correctly ;).

[Haradrim]

also Valinor was a country not a fortress so Valinor doesnt count. That would be like saying ME is my favorite fortress. Also i didnt even know Giants existed in tolkiens works. Huh. :)

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Well they are definitly in the Hobbit.

[Haradrim]

when??

[trolls' bane]

During a storm, when they're in the misty mountains. They went to a cave for refuge, but got taken prisoner by orcs instead.

[BeardofPants]

Yep, from the hobbit POV though, IIRC. IOW, the stone giants causing the storm may not have been stone giants at all... it's a bit contentious.

[Olmer]

General rule of thumb: If Tolkien didn't say it, it's mere speculation.
Sometime Tolkien was giving just a hints, leaving for you to speculate on the giving facts.
Helm's Deep was built by Gondor and later reinforced by Rohan.
But somewhere in the books of ME history I saw the mention of giants in some connection with Rohan. But don't even ask where, because , beats me if I remember in which book to look for. :( :confused:

[Halbarad of the Dunedain]

I think you mean the part where Tolkien speaks in metaphore, saying that Helms deep must have been built by giants of men. Something along those lines. The part in the Hobbit does specificly mention Giants, people seem to read this wrong every time its mentioned, the storm is real and so are the giants, the thingsi s they are both used metephoricly to describe eachother. Anyhow back on the thread subject, My favorite fortress isn't exactlly a fortress but isnt as huge as Valinor either. My favorite... fortress, Haven, city was Andúnië of Númenor. If that doesn't work then I would have to say my second favorite is Minas Ithil, or Minas Morgul.

[Draken]

Giants of men who couldn't manage to build a drawbridge, is my point.

I'll shut up now...

[Valandil]

I think you mean the part where Tolkien speaks in metaphore, saying that Helms deep must have been built by giants of men. Something along those lines. The part in the Hobbit does specificly mention Giants, people seem to read this wrong every time its mentioned, the storm is real and so are the giants, the thingsi s they are both used metephoricly to describe eachother...

Not necessarily... remember that Gandalf also mentions finding some more or less decent giant to plug up the cave the orcs captured them in. I think JRRT intended there to be giants in Middle-earth when he wrote 'The Hobbit'... when he wrote LOTR, he either found no role for them, or discarded the notion.

I think we could satisfy almost everyone (well... maybe THAT's a stretch) to say that there WERE giants in the Misty Mountains - and maybe a few other places, but that they were few in number and rather reclusive. I doubt they could have been coaxed into helping the Numenoreans build Helm's Deep.

Right now though, this line of thinking does bring to mind the two giants hired by the Norse gods to build their palace in Valhalla... :)

[Earniel]

Right now though, this line of thinking does bring to mind the two giants hired by the Norse gods to build their palace in Valhalla... :)
Or the walls of the ancient greek city of Mycene. That type of wall is named 'cyclopean wall' IIRC because the stone blocks are so large that they seemed to be put together by giants. I wonder which of these mythological connections Tolkien used.

[Haradrim]

Andunie is allowed. Just about everything except for countriesd or regions are allowed. Like No ME and No Gondor.

[The Gaffer]

I think JRRT intended there to be giants in Middle-earth when he wrote 'The Hobbit'... when he wrote LOTR, he either found no role for them, or discarded the notion.

Right now though, this line of thinking does bring to mind the two giants hired by the Norse gods to build their palace in Valhalla... :)
Exactly. It seems much of his world was influenced by Norse mythology.

Beorn seems like another such "mathom" in the LOTR bestiary.

Anyway, mine would be Henneth Annun and Minas Morgul because of how they are described in the text and their roles in the story.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Would Henneth Annun be regarded as a fortress?

[Haradrim]

yes it would be. Just no countries or continents. :)

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

What about Moria. That was a country and a fortress.

[Haradrim]

was Moria a country I always thought of it as something between a country and a fortress. A lot of the dwarf kingdoms are like that. Erebor and Moria are relatively similar to that aspect. ALso I meant something like Gondor doesnt count. ANything that has cities towns and/ or multiple lords.

[Sister Golden Hair]

was Moria a country I always thought of it as something between a country and a fortress. A lot of the dwarf kingdoms are like that. Erebor and Moria are relatively similar to that aspect. ALso I meant something like Gondor doesnt count. ANything that has cities towns and/ or multiple lords.Moria was Khazad-dum, but was later called Moria after the Balrog was freed.

[Haradrim]

was khazud-dum a country. i always thought it was just that area surrounding the bridge.

[Sister Golden Hair]

was khazud-dum a country. i always thought it was just that area surrounding the bridge.It was not a country but a great mansion and home of Durin's folk. It was expanded many times.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Did the dwarves have their own name for it because Moria was elvish.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Did the dwarves have their own name for it because Moria was elvish.Here are the names that Foster lists:

Khazad-Dum is dwarvish meaning (dwarf-mansion)

It was called the Dwarrowdelf in Westron

It was called Hadhodrond in Sindarin, although the more usual Elvish name was Moria.

From the latter name came the Westron Black Pit, Black Chasm, and Mines of Moria.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Wouldn't The Mines of Moria be a combination of Westron and elvish hen as Moria was elvish and The Mines of was Westron.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Wouldn't The Mines of Moria be a combination of Westron and elvish hen as Moria was elvish and The Mines of was Westron.Well perhaps someone learned in Elvish can answer. Not my specialty. :)

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

And they dwarves called part of it Dwarrodelf as that is how Gimli referred to it when Merry commented on it.

[Haradrim]

SO T.D. according to SGH moria, khazud-dum, dwarrowdelf, etc is not a country and therefore counts as a fortress.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

So that is my favourite fortress :D

[Haradrim]

Great T.D. but why?

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

It shows the ultimate hieght of the dwarves and they truely loved it. It was like their version of MInas Tirith.

[Haradrim]

Actually its kind of ffunny if you think about it because during LOTR Moria was definately at the peak of it s height and Minas Tirith wasnbt. Of course Minas Tirith was still good controlled but it is kind of funny the way they kind of parralel. Also does anyone know what Osgiliath was like at its height.

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

It was a long city that stretched over the Anduin. It was quite like Minas Tirith and was in the middle of Minas Ithil and Minas Anor. (I think :D)

[Michael Martinez]

It was a long city that stretched over the Anduin. It was quite like Minas Tirith and was in the middle of Minas Ithil and Minas Anor. (I think :D)

Osgiliath started out as a city built upon an immense bridge spanning the Anduin. It had gates at both ends of the bridge and the two kings had a hall or tower somewhere in the middle where their thrones were stationed side by side.

Eventually, the city grew large enough that buildings were erected on both sides of the river. Their ruins are described in The Lord of the Rings.

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

i would have to say Gondolin
the city of the hill of singing stone, or something to that effect
turgon built a perfect city there, i think

[Lenya]

Minas Tirith - I love their whole circle-walls-thing. It's a stunning defense strategy.

[Pytt]

Gondolin or Nargothrond. I really love caves, so maybe you can put Moria and Doriath there as well, but not if I could pick.

[Dark Lord Sauron]

Barad-dûr was built by Sauron, the Dark Lord of Mordor, with the power of the One Ring, during the Second Age. The building took six hundred years to complete; it was the greatest fortress ever built since the Fall of Angband, and much of Sauron's personal power went into it.

Barad-dûr was besieged for seven years by the Last Alliance of Elves and Men, and was leveled after Sauron's defeat at the end of the Second Age, but because it was created using the power of the One Ring its foundations could not be destroyed completely unless the Ring itself should be destroyed. Isildur failed to destroy the Ring, and so the tower was re-built when Sauron returned to Mordor thousands of years later.

Only when the One Ring was destroyed did the Tower finally fall; without Sauron's power to sustain it, it could not stand. Barad-dûr collapsed to ruin and Sauron was finally defeated.

The Dark Tower was described as existing on a massive scale so large it was almost surreal, although Tolkien does not provide much detail beyond its size and immense strength. Since it had a "topmost tower" (the location of the Window of the Eye, from which the Eye of Sauron gazed out over Middle-earth), it presumably had multiple towers. It is otherwise descripted as dark and surrounded in shadow, so that it could not be clearly seen.


Indeed, there is no greater fortress in all of Endor.

[Nurvingiel]

What about Thangorodruim? Before its demise anyway. (Hazy Sil knowledge... :o )

[Pytt]

was that directed to me?
yes, offcourse, a place where eagles can live is a favourite :)

[Lenya]

OK, we get it. You love the Eagles. You've made that point rather clear :p

[me9996]

Propubly ( :eek: bad spelling!) rivindail... that's not a fortress? Is it?

How about balan-dor?

[Lenya]

Propubly ( :eek: bad spelling!) rivindail... that's not a fortress? Is it?

How about balan-dor?


Why do you choose that?

[Elemmírë]

Like Nurvs says, definitely Thangorodrim over Barad-Dur. I love the way that thing was destroyed... :evil:

Propubly ( :eek: bad spelling!) rivindail... that's not a fortress? Is it?

How about balan-dor?

Rivendell. Sindarin: Imladris.

I don't think it's a fortress. But I'm not sure.

Is the second one supposed to be Barad-dur, or do I need to go back and reread LotR?

[Sister Golden Hair]

Rivendell was an Elven-refuge in a steep and hidden valley in the Angle

[me9996]

Like Nurvs says, definitely Thangorodrim over Barad-Dur. I love the way that thing was destroyed... :evil:



Rivendell. Sindarin: Imladris.

I don't think it's a fortress. But I'm not sure.

Is the second one supposed to be Barad-dur, or do I need to go back and reread LotR?
If that's Sour-ons fortress...
P.S.
Have you ever broken up a word and found another in it?

[Keith K]

two places come to my mind on this subject. I always liked Turins hideout on amon rudh. It is strategically located out in the open....yet hidden at the same time. Guarding the contested area between Doriath and Nargothrond before they fell. A very dangerous area of Beleriand. Also, my imagination is fired by Caranthir's abode near Mt Rerir in Thargelion...barely mentioned in the narrative it is the area where the Noldor first encountered the Dwarves of Belegost and Nogrod. I would have liked to have visited there during the years of the Watchful Peace....

[Aphanuzîr]

Sister Golden Hair posted:Rivendell was an Elven-refuge in a steep and hidden valley in the Angle What was meant by 'the Angle' was usually the land between the Hoarwell and the Loudwater, to the south of the Trollshaws:

Appendix A:Rhudaur was in the North-east and lay between the Ettenmoors, the Weather Hills, and the Misty Mountains, but included also the Angle between the Hoarwell and the Loudwater. It was at this time that the Stoors that had dwelt in the Angle (between Hoarwell and Loudwater) fled west and south
However, the 'angle' between the Silverlode and the Anduin was also called the Naith (= 'the Gore' or 'the Angle') by the Galadhrim):

'Lothlórien': `Now, friends,' said Haldir, `you have entered the Naith of Lórien or the Gore, as you would say, for it is the land that lies like a spear-head between the arms of Silverlode and Anduin the Great. We allow no strangers to spy out the secrets of the Naith. Few indeed are permitted even to set foot there.
`As was agreed, I shall here blindfold the eyes of Gimli the Dwarf. The other may walk free for a while, until we come nearer to our dwellings, down in Egladil, in the Angle between the waters.' There are also other mentioned instances of 'angles', but these are not written with capital 'a', so 'the Angle' as a term for these was probably not as common as 'the Angle' for the lands between Hoarwell and Loudwater and between the Silverlode and the Anduin. But the land in which Rivendell stood could indeed also be thought of as an 'angle'.

[strider8]

My favourite fortress is probably orthanc because of its strange shape. :)

[Este of Lorien]

Gondolin. And Himring (if Maedhros is there :) )

[Gordis]

Minas Morgul. Beautiful gleaming walls, nice white flowers along the Morgulduin, quiet surroundings, spectacular view :evil: .

[Lenya]

Off topic but I have to say it. Love your avvie :cool:

[Rían]

Gondolin! Cool place :cool:

[Gordis]

Off topic but I have to say it. Love your avvie :cool:
Thank you, Lenya. Making a new avvie helps a lot when I get bored with my work.

[Voronwen]

Just no countries or continents.

Andúnië

Armenelos

Rómenna

Annúminas

Emyn Beraid

Amon Sul

:cool: